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<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//EN"
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<title>SV_MEETING_TITLE -- 02 Feb 2010</title>
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<p><a href="http://www.w3.org/"><img src=
"http://www.w3.org/Icons/w3c_home" alt="W3C" border="0" height=
"48" width="72" /></a></p>
<h1>- DRAFT -</h1>
<h1>SV_MEETING_TITLE</h1>
<h2>02 Feb 2010</h2>
<p>See also: <a href=
"http://www.w3.org/2010/02/02-mediaann-irc">IRC log</a></p>
<h2><a name="attendees" id="attendees">Attendees</a></h2>
<div class="intro">
<dl>
<dt>Present</dt>
<dd>joakim, tmichel, tobiasb, pchampin, chris, Daniel,
John_Strassner</dd>
<dt>Regrets</dt>
<dt>Chair</dt>
<dd>SV_MEETING_CHAIR</dd>
<dt>Scribe</dt>
<dd>pchampin</dd>
</dl>
</div>
<h2>Contents</h2>
<ul>
<li>
<a href="#agenda">Topics</a>
<ol>
<li><a href="#item01">Agenda review and approval of
previous minutes telecon</a></li>
<li><a href=
"#item02">http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2010Jan/0057.html</a></li>
<li><a href="#item03">Selection of scribe for next
meeting</a></li>
<li><a href="#item04">Presenation of new participants: John
Strassner and Ashish Chawla</a></li>
<li><a href="#item05">action items</a></li>
<li><a href="#item06">Discussion a web based implementation
of the test suite</a></li>
<li><a href="#item07">library discussion</a></li>
<li><a href="#item08">next next F2F in Vienna</a></li>
</ol>
</li>
<li><a href="#ActionSummary">Summary of Action Items</a></li>
</ul>
<hr />
<div class="meeting">
<p class='phone'></p>
<p class='phone'>hi all</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; ok</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; on my way in
again</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; Chris is guilty!</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; No no, we need
him</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>scribe</cite>&gt; scribe: pchampin</p>
<h3 id="item01">Agenda review and approval of previous minutes
telecon</h3>
<p class='phone'>minutes of the last meeting approved</p>
<h3 id="item02"><a href=
"http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2010Jan/0057.html">
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2010Jan/0057.html</a></h3>
<h3 id="item03">Selection of scribe for next meeting</h3>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; <a href=
"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/wiki/Main_Page">http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/wiki/Main_Page</a></p>
<p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> any volunteer for next
week (2010-02-09)?</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>pchampin:</cite> the scribe list is
actually on the main page</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Daniel:</cite> we don't have a scribe
for next week</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Thierry:</cite> I can't next week, but I
volunteer for the following week (2010-02-16)</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>tmichel</cite>&gt; right my rerets for
next week.</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>chris</cite>&gt; I will not be
available either next week</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Florian:</cite> I will scribe next
week</p>
<h3 id="item04">Presenation of new participants: John Strassner
and Ashish Chawla</h3>
<p class='phone'><cite>John:</cite> I sent an email to the
list<br />
... full professor in South Korea<br />
... chair or co-chair of several orga: IETF, IEEE...<br />
... autonomic(?) communications<br />
... expertise: knowledge engineering</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Somebody:</cite> ring, ring, ring</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>chris</cite>&gt; I will follow the
phone conf through IRC</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>John:</cite> ... (covered by
ringing)</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>tmichel</cite>&gt; joakim is noisy
;-)</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>chris</cite>&gt; sorry for the
noise</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> what is your interest in
the WG?</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>john:</cite> teaching graduiate level
course on semantic reasoning<br />
... about 1/ covering various knowledge representations<br />
... 2/ decision making (inferencing)<br />
... e.g. using ontologies<br />
... 2 PhD students interested in knowledge engineering<br />
... worked for Motorola in the advance used of annotation<br />
... for context-aware functionality<br />
... I'm known for network management<br />
... but have never been satisfied by the tools used<br />
... so looking for better ontologies, better semiotics in the
network management field<br />
... volunteer to take action items or participate in editing
documents</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> thanks for joining</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>john:</cite> was invited by Daniel</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> is Ashish here?</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; <a href=
"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/track/actions/open">
http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/track/actions/open</a></p>
<p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> apparently not</p>
<h3 id="item05">action items</h3>
<p class='phone'>action-124?</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; ACTION-124 --
Felix Sasaki to check - everybody responsible for a format: add
a column describing syntactic information ("data types", see
cable lab column "Type") to his table -- due 2009-06-16 --
OPEN</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; <a href=
"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/track/actions/124">
http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/track/actions/124</a></p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>scribe</cite>&gt; ongoing</p>
<p class='phone'>close action-196</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; ACTION-196 update
scribe list closed</p>
<h3 id="item06">Discussion a web based implementation of the
test suite</h3>
<p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> sent an email proposing
to use XML as an input format</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>pchampin:</cite> didn't have time this
week to have a look at it</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>Daniel</cite>&gt; <a href=
"http://www.w3.org/TR/2010/NOTE-test-methodology-20100128/">http://www.w3.org/TR/2010/NOTE-test-methodology-20100128/</a></p><a name="action01"
id="action01"></a>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>scribe</cite>&gt;
<strong>ACTION:</strong> pchampin to read and sumarize
test-methodolofy for the group [recorded in <a href=
"http://www.w3.org/2010/02/02-mediaann-minutes.html#action01">http://www.w3.org/2010/02/02-mediaann-minutes.html#action01</a>]</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; Created ACTION-208
- Read and sumarize test-methodolofy for the group [on
Pierre-Antoine Champin - due 2010-02-09].</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>Daniel</cite>&gt; <a href=
"http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2010Jan/0059.html">
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2010Jan/0059.html</a></p>
<p class='phone'><cite>pchampin:</cite> two problems for
implementations:</p>
<p class='phone'>1/ extract the legacy metadata from the
original format</p>
<p class='phone'>2/ map that metadata to the vocabulary</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> the testsuite should be
about 2/</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; if we provide the
legacy md in an artifical format the test will not be fair</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>chris</cite>&gt; I agree with joakim
that the testsuite should be about 2/</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>pchampin:</cite> I agree too</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>chris</cite>&gt; We wouldn't suggest a
specific XML parser either to extract information from the XML
metadata</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>pchampin:</cite> but I don't think its
is practical to separate the two in an implementation</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>chris</cite>&gt; so I dont think it
would be good to specify specific software libraries for the
embedded metadata</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>pchampin:</cite> anyway, implementations
will *have* to do 1/</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>chris</cite>&gt; indeed</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>pchampin:</cite> assume that an
implementation does the mapping correctly<br />
... but extracts the metadata in a wrong way<br />
... would we like it to pass the tests?<br />
... because in a real situation, it would not give the expected
results</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> the metadata formats are
various: XML-based, binary...<br />
... there are several cases to deal with</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; the test should deal
with the md as in the "WILD!"</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>pchampin:</cite> yes, but I suggest we
provide "ecological" metadata rather than artifical
metadata</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>chris</cite>&gt; I agree, it is the
responsibility of the implementation to get the embedded
metadata out a file and to map it accordingly</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>chris</cite>&gt; so this should be
part of the testsuite</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>chris</cite>&gt; maybe we can make two
different test suites, one for embbeded metadata and one for
external metadata?</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>pchampin:</cite> I am favorable to
providing the "extracted" metadata</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>florian</cite>&gt; +1</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>pchampin:</cite> just for the
implementors to check that they are extracting the metadata in
a consistent way<br />
... but they are expected to run the test on the "real"
format</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; Should we provide
the test with both media file and extracted md?</p>
<p class='phone'>+1</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>florian</cite>&gt; +1</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>pchampin:</cite> furthermore, it would
allow us to detect errors in the test suites</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; thierry?</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>florian:</cite> I like the idea, but
will the W3C like it?</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>pchampin:</cite> I'll tell you when I
have read the document</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; Chris?</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; Chris can you call
in again?</p>
<h3 id="item07">library discussion</h3>
<p class='phone'><cite>florian:</cite> suggested that the
Caliph project could be used to extract metadata</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> I had a quick look at
their web page<br />
... it's interesting</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>florian:</cite> the focus is on
annotation<br />
... though they have support for extraction<br />
... and it is opensource<br />
... currently worling on cophir</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>florian</cite>&gt; <a href=
"http://cophir.isti.cnr.it/">http://cophir.isti.cnr.it/</a></p>
<p class='phone'><cite>florian:</cite> photos from flickr<br />
... extract MPEG7 features<br />
... with a link to the image<br />
... we are working to setup a crawler<br />
... and also extract DC metadata</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> where do you get the
MPEG-7 features?</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>florian:</cite> they are provided by the
cophir testsuite<br />
... we could use this as a base for our testsuites<br />
... this is a student work, so I don't know when it will be
finished</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>Daniel</cite>&gt; Florian: what
application this project is targetting for ?</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>florian:</cite> just building the
crawler<br />
... to provide the images with DC and MPEG7 metadata</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>daniel:</cite> what about exif?</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>florian:</cite> out of scope for the
student, as exif can be extracted directly from the jpeg</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> so the task of the
student is to fill in the gap?</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>chris</cite>&gt; the semantic gap?</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>florian:</cite> yes, we extract legacy
md from the flickr API, and map it to DC<br />
... and MPEG7 (?)</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; not semantic
gap!</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>florian:</cite> I'll write to Chris
about it :)</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>florian</cite>&gt; Chris, we only use
the id of an image to extract metadata using the flickr api -
this extracted metadata will be stored in DC and
MPEG-7</p><a name="action02" id="action02"></a>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>scribe</cite>&gt;
<strong>ACTION:</strong> florian to share his image metadata
with the group (when he has it) [recorded in <a href=
"http://www.w3.org/2010/02/02-mediaann-minutes.html#action02">http://www.w3.org/2010/02/02-mediaann-minutes.html#action02</a>]</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; Created ACTION-209
- Share his image metadata with the group (when he has it) [on
Florian Stegmaier - due 2010-02-09].</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>chris</cite>&gt; ok</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>florian</cite>&gt; and the IDs are
stored in the COPHIR test suite wit the mpeg-7 low level
features</p>
<h3 id="item08">next next F2F in Vienna</h3>
<p class='phone'><cite>florian:</cite> last week of april</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>daniel:</cite> we already had a straw
poll, there should not be problems</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>tmichel</cite>&gt; I will
participate</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>daniel:</cite> who is supposed to
participate in the Seoul meeting?</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>tmichel</cite>&gt; to Seoul</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>chris</cite>&gt; I will be there</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> will online presence be
possible in Seoul?</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>tmichel:</cite> shall I reserve a phone
bridge?</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>daniel:</cite> yes</p>
<p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; Chris will you join
next telcon?</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> we will discuss the API
document next week</p>
</div>
<h2><a name="ActionSummary" id="ActionSummary">Summary of Action
Items</a></h2><!-- Action Items -->
<strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> florian to share
his image metadata with the group (when he has it) [recorded in
<a href=
"http://www.w3.org/2010/02/02-mediaann-minutes.html#action02">http://www.w3.org/2010/02/02-mediaann-minutes.html#action02</a>]<br />
<strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> pchampin to read
and sumarize test-methodolofy for the group [recorded in <a href=
"http://www.w3.org/2010/02/02-mediaann-minutes.html#action01">http://www.w3.org/2010/02/02-mediaann-minutes.html#action01</a>]<br />
&nbsp;<br />
[End of minutes]<br />
<hr />
<address>
Minutes formatted by David Booth's <a href=
"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm">
scribe.perl</a> version 1.135 (<a href=
"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/">CVS log</a>)<br />
$Date: 2010/02/02 13:01:59 $
</address>
<div class="diagnostics">
<hr />
<h2>Scribe.perl diagnostic output</h2>[Delete this section
before finalizing the minutes.]<br />
<pre>
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.135 of Date: 2009/03/02 03:52:20
Check for newer version at <a href=
"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/">http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/</a>
Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)
Succeeded: s/ergonomic/autonomic/
Succeeded: s/liek/like/
Succeeded: s/PROJECT/cophir/
Succeeded: s/crawelr/crawler/
Found Scribe: pchampin
Inferring ScribeNick: pchampin
Present: joakim tmichel tobiasb pchampin chris Daniel John_Strassner
WARNING: No meeting title found!
You should specify the meeting title like this:
&lt;dbooth&gt; Meeting: Weekly Baking Club Meeting
WARNING: No meeting chair found!
You should specify the meeting chair like this:
&lt;dbooth&gt; Chair: dbooth
Got date from IRC log name: 02 Feb 2010
Guessing minutes URL: <a href=
"http://www.w3.org/2010/02/02-mediaann-minutes.html">http://www.w3.org/2010/02/02-mediaann-minutes.html</a>
People with action items: florian pchampin
</pre>[End of <a href=
"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm">
scribe.perl</a> diagnostic output]
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