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423 lines
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423 lines
14 KiB
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<title>Media Fragments Working Group Teleconference -- 13 May
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2009</title>
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<p><a href="http://www.w3.org/"><img src=
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<h1>Media Fragments Working Group Teleconference</h1>
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<h2>13 May 2009</h2>
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<p><a href=
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'http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-fragment/2009May/0022.html'>
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Agenda</a></p>
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<p>See also: <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2009/05/13-mediafrag-irc">IRC log</a></p>
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<h2><a name="attendees" id="attendees">Attendees</a></h2>
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<div class="intro">
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<dl>
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<dt>Present</dt>
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<dd>Silvia, Michael, Raphael, Gui, Conrad</dd>
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<dt>Regrets</dt>
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<dd>Yves, Erik, Davy</dd>
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<dt>Chair</dt>
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<dd>Raphael</dd>
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<dt>Scribe</dt>
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<dd>Guillaume</dd>
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</dl>
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</div>
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<h2>Contents</h2>
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<ul>
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<li>
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<a href="#agenda">Topics</a>
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<ol>
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<li><a href="#item01">ADMIN, next conference</a></li>
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<li><a href="#item02">UC & Requirements</a></li>
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<li><a href="#item03">UA Server HTTP Communication</a></li>
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<li><a href="#item04">UA MF Resolution and
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Processing</a></li>
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<li><a href="#item05">TEST CASES</a></li>
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</ol>
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</li>
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<li><a href="#ActionSummary">Summary of Action Items</a></li>
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</ul>
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<hr />
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<div class="meeting">
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<p class='phone'> </p>
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<p class='phone'> </p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Date: 13 May
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2009</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>Gui</cite>> yes</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>raphael</cite>> Scribe:
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Guillaume</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>raphael</cite>> Scribenick: yes</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>mhausenblas</cite>> Scribenick:
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Gui</p>
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<h3 id="item01">ADMIN, next conference</h3>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>raphael</cite>> Minutes: <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2009/04/29-mediafrag-minutes.html">http://www.w3.org/2009/04/29-mediafrag-minutes.html</a></p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>raphael</cite>> +1</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>mhausenblas</cite>> +1</p>
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<p class='phone'>Accepting minutes</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>silvia</cite>> +1</p>
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<p class='phone'>Ok, minutes of the 29 April 2009 telecom
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accepted</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>raphael</cite>> Summary: unlikely
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that Conrad, Silvia and Guillaume can make the Amsterdam
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meeting</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>raphael</cite>> ... easier for
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Europeans (Michael, Jack, Raphael, what about Yves?)</p>
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<h3 id="item02">UC & Requirements</h3>
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<p class='phone'>The working draft has been published</p>
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<p class='phone'>All actions arel ongoing</p>
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<p class='phone'>TOPIC UA Server HTTP Communication</p>
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<h3 id="item03">UA Server HTTP Communication</h3>
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<p class='phone'>Conrad will discuss this at the next
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teleconf</p>
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<p class='phone'>We need to start capturing what we recommend
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regarding the use of "?" and "#"</p>
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<p class='phone'>Silvia is getting inputs from the HTML5
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mailing-list, any specific information that's relevant we
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should look at? Silvia and Conrad please keep track.</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>raphael</cite>> Raphael: in the
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next iteration of the document, we should clearly clarify the
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role of '#' and '?'</p>
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<p class='phone'>Further discussions about the MF syntax giving
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absolute times mechanism. It is a big requirement. Silvia to
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continue discuss with Thomas.</p>
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<h3 id="item04">UA MF Resolution and Processing</h3>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>raphael</cite>> <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/UserAgentMediaFragmentResolution">
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http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/UserAgentMediaFragmentResolution</a></p>
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<p class='phone'>Michael would like to take us through the
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document at some point.</p>
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<p class='phone'>In the sequence of things, two things needs to
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be explained :</p>
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<p class='phone'>the template of HTTP headers</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>raphael</cite>> <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/UA_Server_RTSP_Communication">
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http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/UA_Server_RTSP_Communication</a></p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>silvia</cite>> <a href=
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"http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2326.txt">http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2326.txt</a>
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<- rtsp spec</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>silvia</cite>> <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Image:Rtsp.jpg">
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http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Image:Rtsp.jpg</a>
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<- synchronise this picture with more details with the one
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for http</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>mhausenblas</cite>> thanks
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silvia</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>silvia</cite>> :)</p>
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<h3 id="item05">TEST CASES</h3>
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<p class='phone'>Discussing the issues raised on the mailing
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list</p>
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<p class='phone'>e.g. t=10,</p>
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<p class='phone'>Is it good syntax or not?</p>
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<p class='phone'>Do we need to specify the media type as well
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for each test case?</p>
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<p class='phone'>1. the way to express the media type in the
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fragment syntax (only the server would need to know)</p>
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<p class='phone'>2. Write the media type inside the Test case
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results</p>
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<p class='phone'>(We need this data to be able to report on the
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test cases)</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>raphael</cite>> trackbot,
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status</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>ISSUE:</cite> Should we have the media
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type inside the Test Cases?</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Created ISSUE-9 -
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Should we have the media type inside the Test Cases? ; please
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complete additional details at <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/tracker/issues/9/edit">
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http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/tracker/issues/9/edit</a>
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.</p>
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<p class='phone'>Let's go through each test case and spend one
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or two minute on each during a teleconf (now?)</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>mhausenblas</cite>> +1</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>conrad</cite>> +1</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>raphael</cite>> TC0000: <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/TestCases#TC0000:_empty_MF:">
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http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/TestCases#TC0000:_empty_MF:</a>
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reviewed and agreed</p>
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<p class='phone'>TC empty MF - Is there cases where the MF
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conforming UAs would behave differently?</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>silvia</cite>> +1</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>silvia</cite>> no</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>TC0001:</cite> undefined time segment -
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npt - Would we expect an output?</p>
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<p class='phone'>Do we agree that the output should be the
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entire resource?</p>
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<p class='phone'>it should be unspecified?</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>silvia</cite>> I agree - it should
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be the entire resource</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>conrad</cite>> TC0001: +1</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>mhausenblas</cite>> Scribenick:
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mhausenblas</p>
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<p class='phone'><strong class='resolution'>RESOLUTION: TC0001
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accepted as proposed</strong></p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>Gui_</cite>> TC0002: empty time
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segment - npt</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>silvia</cite>> #t=0,0 could be
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written as #t=x,x</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>scribe</cite>> Scribenick: Gui_</p>
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<p class='phone'>#t=x,x, where x=x</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>conrad</cite>> i think that in
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barcelona we were talking about a zero-duration media file as
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the output of this</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>silvia</cite>> where x is
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integer</p>
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<p class='phone'>Can a "zero duration media" be returned?</p>
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<p class='phone'>The resource exists, it's just that we return
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an empty fragment of it</p>
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<p class='phone'>Should we be returning a frame as empty
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content?</p>
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<p class='phone'>What is the purpose, a blank screen for Video,
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what about the case of Audio?</p>
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<p class='phone'>Maybe this is useful as "place holders"</p>
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<p class='phone'>Either we signal to the client that's it's a
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error (it's not allowed to do it) or it should be for some
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usage</p>
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<p class='phone'>It could be in the content header, Content not
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acceptable 406 or 416 the requested range is not
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satisfiable</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>silvia</cite>> I think: 416
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Requested Range Not Satisfiable</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>raphael</cite>> I think too
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Silvia</p><a name="action01" id="action01"></a>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>mhausenblas</cite>>
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<strong>ACTION:</strong> Michael to summarise the options for
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4xx status code for empty TC0002-0007 in a Wiki page [recorded
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in <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2009/05/13-mediafrag-minutes.html#action01">http://www.w3.org/2009/05/13-mediafrag-minutes.html#action01</a>]</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Created ACTION-79
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- Summarise the options for 4xx status code for empty
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TC0002-0007 in a Wiki page [on Michael Hausenblas - due
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2009-05-20].</p>
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<p class='phone'>For all the TC returning EMPTY, what should
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the response be to the UA be (see HTTP codes)?</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>conrad</cite>> i think 416 if and
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only if the fragment range was given in an HTTP Range request
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header; a different error notification method otherwise :-)</p>
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<p class='phone'>We need to have these resolutions (on which
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HTTP codes we decide to use) written down</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>silvia</cite>> conrad: I assumed
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that, too</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>conrad</cite>> eg. #track= will not
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be handled through Range request</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>mhausenblas</cite>> RESOLVED: The
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WG agrees that empty is not an error (as in 404) but a
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recoverable state</p>
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<p class='phone'>Summarize what would the different responses
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be depending on the request (range request, others)</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>conrad</cite>> i agree with
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silvia</p>
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<p class='phone'>If the UA request a fragment of the entire
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duration, it should get notified with 206</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>conrad</cite>> but 200 for TC0</p>
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<p class='phone'>thanks conrad</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>conrad</cite>> +1</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>conrad</cite>> client should ignore
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stupid request and not bother wasting the server's time</p>
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<p class='phone'><strong class='resolution'>RESOLUTION: We
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agree that the HTTP response code should be 200 for
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TC0000</strong></p>
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<p class='phone'><strong class='resolution'>RESOLUTION: We
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agree that the HTTP response code should be 200 for TC0000,
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TC0001 should be 200 and the UA strip what's behind the
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#</strong></p>
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<p class='phone'>For TC0002-6, Michael as an action</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>mhausenblas</cite>> so that #t=,
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-> # which makes TC0001 == TC0000 ;)</p>
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<p class='phone'><strong class='resolution'>RESOLUTION: The WG
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agrees that empty responses is NOT an error, so it's not a
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404</strong></p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>conrad</cite>> +1 mhausenblas (and
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if we don't specify the details, implementers will choose
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arbitrarily :)</p>
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<p class='phone'>It takes a long time to go through the TC, we
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need to continue doing so. Michael, with our resolutions, will
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be able to reflect changes on the Wiki. Thanks Michael</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>mhausenblas</cite>> ;) true,
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conrad. sad but true ;)</p>
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<p class='phone'>we are running out of time, and closing the
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teleconf for today.</p>
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<p class='phone'>Nothing futher to discuss? no!</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>conrad</cite>> ok!</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>silvia</cite>> cool :)</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>conrad</cite>> thanks all :-)</p>
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<p class='phone'>Thanks you everyone! Have a nice week!</p>
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<p class='phone'>Bye</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>mhausenblas</cite>> [adjourned]</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>mhausenblas</cite>> hang on</p>
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<p class='phone'>trackbot, status</p>
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</div>
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<h2><a name="ActionSummary" id="ActionSummary">Summary of Action
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Items</a></h2><!-- Action Items -->
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<strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> Michael to
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summarise the options for 4xx status code for empty TC0002-0007
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in a Wiki page [recorded in <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2009/05/13-mediafrag-minutes.html#action01">http://www.w3.org/2009/05/13-mediafrag-minutes.html#action01</a>]<br />
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<br />
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[End of minutes]<br />
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<hr />
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<address>
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Minutes formatted by David Booth's <a href=
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"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm">
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scribe.perl</a> version 1.135 (<a href=
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"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/">CVS log</a>)<br />
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$Date: 2009/05/13 14:55:32 $
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</address>
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