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322 lines
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322 lines
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<meta name="generator" content=
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<title>Media Fragments Working Group Teleconference -- 07 Jul
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2010</title>
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<h1>Media Fragments Working Group Teleconference</h1>
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<h2>07 Jul 2010</h2>
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<p><a href=
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'http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-fragment/2010Jul/0023.html'>
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Agenda</a></p>
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<p>See also: <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2010/07/07-mediafrag-irc">IRC log</a></p>
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<h2><a name="attendees" id="attendees">Attendees</a></h2>
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<div class="intro">
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<dl>
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<dt>Present</dt>
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<dd>Raphael, Davy, Philip, Yves</dd>
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<dt>Regrets</dt>
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<dd>Silvia, Erik, Jack</dd>
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<dt>Chair</dt>
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<dd>raphael</dd>
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<dt>Scribe</dt>
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<dd>raphael</dd>
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</dl>
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</div>
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<h2>Contents</h2>
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<ul>
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<li>
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<a href="#agenda">Topics</a>
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<ol>
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<li><a href="#item01">1. Admin</a></li>
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<li><a href="#item02">2. Specification</a></li>
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<li><a href="#item03">3. Save as Use Case</a></li>
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<li><a href="#item04">4. AOB</a></li>
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</ol>
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</li>
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<li><a href="#ActionSummary">Summary of Action Items</a></li>
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</ul>
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<hr />
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<div class="meeting">
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<p class='phone'></p>
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<p class='phone'></p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Date: 07 July
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2010</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>foolip</cite>> the bridge just
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keeps hanging up on me</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>foolip</cite>> UK and France</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>foolip</cite>> ok, that worked</p>
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<h3 id="item01">1. Admin</h3>
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<p class='phone'>Approved minutes of past telecon</p>
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<p class='phone'><a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2010/06/23-mediafrag-minutes.html">http://www.w3.org/2010/06/23-mediafrag-minutes.html</a></p>
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<p class='phone'><a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2010/06/30-mediafrag-minutes.html">http://www.w3.org/2010/06/30-mediafrag-minutes.html</a></p>
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<p class='phone'>+1</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>dvdeurse</cite>> +1</p>
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<p class='phone'>minutes accepted</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>foolip</cite>> +1</p>
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<p class='phone'>This will be last telecon for this summer</p>
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<p class='phone'>Next telecon will be 25/08</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>scribe</cite>> scribe: raphael</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>scribe</cite>> scribenick:
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raphael</p>
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<h3 id="item02">2. Specification</h3>
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<p class='phone'>Discussion about parsing name values pairs</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Philip:</cite> name values pairs unknown
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should it be ignored ?<br />
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... and how we manage percent-decoding</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>Yves</cite>> <a href=
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"http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-fragment/2010Jul/0024.html">
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http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-fragment/2010Jul/0024.html</a></p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>Yves</cite>> axissegment =
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anysegment *( "&" anysegment )</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Philip:</cite> my intention is to say
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that anysegment is timesegment, spacefragment, trackfragment,
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or unknown fragment</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>Yves</cite>> <a href=
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"http://www.example.com/foo.mov#foo=bar">http://www.example.com/foo.mov#foo=bar</a></p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Philip:</cite> but this does not work
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either since there is the problem of percent decoding<br />
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... I'm fine with <a href=
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"http://www.example.com/foo.mov#foo=bar">http://www.example.com/foo.mov#foo=bar</a>
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not be a media fragment</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> the issue is more if the t=
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is percent encoded<br />
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... I suggest to do this first step normalization step, doing
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at least percent-decoding of characters that are not delims,
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sub-delims, and other non-safe characters.</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Philip:</cite> problem of the + sign in
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the timezone<br />
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... it seems to me very complex while what I propose seems
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simpler<br />
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... the spec is currently contradictory<br />
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... since the grammar says that arbitrary name value pairs is
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not valid</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> how do you manage
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extensibility</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> do we really want
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extensibility?<br />
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... I'm not sure it is desirable</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> her position "I
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personally believe they should be valid, since our discussion
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was</p>
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<p class='phone'>always that we would ignore name-value
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parameters that the UA (or the</p>
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<p class='phone'>server) doesn't understand.</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>scribe:</cite> the example was: <a href=
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"http://www.example.com/football.movie#t=10">http://www.example.com/football.movie#t=10</a>,20&action=track</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> I'm not for being
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completely open to extensibility</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Philip:</cite> you speculate a lot on
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what people could add after the # but should we really care
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about this ?</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> I notice clearly a
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disagreement in the group currently</p>
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<p class='phone'>Yves's position is that for any unknow name
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values pair, the entire fragment sould be ignored</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>scribe:</cite> which is not clearly the
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position of Philip, and I think not what Silvia is thinking
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too</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Davy:</cite> I understand Yves'as
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argument about I'm also concerned by the lack of forward
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compatibility</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Philip:</cite> the current syntax is too
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strong on my opinion, so I don't want to have it normative</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> it is to be on the safe
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side for me to forbid unknown name value pairs</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> other problem is
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%-decoding<br />
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... to we want to allow %-encode of t</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Philip:</cite> yes, but then you're
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generic and don't need to treat track and id as special
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cases</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>Yves</cite>> <a href=
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"http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc3986.txt">http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc3986.txt</a>
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=> 2.4. When to Encode or Decode</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> I suggest to add a
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paragraph in section 4.1<br />
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... explaining a normalization step</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>Yves</cite>> %74=10,20</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>Yves</cite>> normlziation phase
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=> t=10,20</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>Yves</cite>> track=foo%3dbar</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>Yves</cite>> normalization phase
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=> track=foo%3dbar</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>Yves</cite>> track foo%3dbar</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>Yves</cite>> foo=bar</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Philip:</cite> I don't see the value of
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this pre-process step</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> we first need to extract
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the name value pairs<br />
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... before making the URI %-decoding step</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Philip:</cite> we should first do
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parsing of arbitrary name value pairs<br />
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... and then process those name value pairs<br />
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... we then interpret the unicode syntax that results of the
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%-decoding of those pairs</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>davy</cite>> +1 to Philip, this is
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also the way we parse fragments in our player</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> I agree that this is a way
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to do it ... but this will not be my way, I would implement it
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differently</p>
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<p class='phone'>close ACTION-182</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> ACTION-182 Include
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summary into wiki page closed</p>
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<h3 id="item03">3. Save as Use Case</h3>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>foolip</cite>> raphael, I have to
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run for lunch, are we done discussing "my" issue?</p>
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<p class='phone'>yes foolip, until September where we will
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discuss the issue again</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>foolip</cite>> ok, thanks all!</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>scribe:</cite> and before on the mailing
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list</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Davy:</cite> I think we should save the
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whole media</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> save as the whole page ...
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would mean to save the html, the css, and the media _fragment_
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(only the bytes downloaded)<br />
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... save as the media would mean save the entire media file</p>
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<p class='phone'>Chris question: Is it expected that for every
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URL request with a fragment that matches</p>
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<p class='phone'>the syntax of media fragments that the user
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agent will attempt to send</p>
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<p class='phone'>the Range header?</p>
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<p class='phone'>YES</p>
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<p class='phone'>I'm going through <a href=
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"http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-fragment/2010Jun/0099.html">
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http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-fragment/2010Jun/0099.html</a></p>
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<h3 id="item04">4. AOB</h3>
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<p class='phone'>I will answer Chris</p>
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</div>
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<h2><a name="ActionSummary" id="ActionSummary">Summary of Action
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Items</a></h2><!-- Action Items -->
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[End of minutes]<br />
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<hr />
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<address>
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Minutes formatted by David Booth's <a href=
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"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm">
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scribe.perl</a> version 1.135 (<a href=
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"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/">CVS log</a>)<br />
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$Date: 2010/07/07 10:29:00 $
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</address>
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