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<title>mawg -- 25 Nov 2008</title>
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<body><p><a href="http://www.w3.org/"><img src="http://www.w3.org/Icons/w3c_home" alt="W3C"
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border="0" height="48" width="72"/></a></p><h1>mawg</h1><h2>25 Nov
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2008</h2><p><a
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href="http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2008Nov/0124.html">
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Agenda</a></p><p>See also: <a href="http://www.w3.org/2008/11/25-mediaann-irc">IRC
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log</a></p><h2><a name="attendees" id="attendees">Attendees</a></h2><div class="intro">
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<dl>
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<dt>Present</dt>
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<dd>ruben, tobiasb, veronique, pchampin, Felix, Ernie, jcraig, Wonsuk, Davy, Joakim, frank,
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Daniel</dd>
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<dt>Regrets</dt>
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<dd>Raphael, Hui, Werner, Thierry, Victor</dd>
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<dt>Chair</dt>
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<dd>Felix</dd>
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<dt>Scribe</dt>
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<dd>Joakim</dd>
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</dl>
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</div><h2>Contents</h2><ul>
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<li>
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<a href="#agenda">Topics</a>
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<ol>
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<li><a href="#item01">Agenda review / approval of previous minutes</a></li>
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<li><a href="#item02">Selection of scribe for next meeting</a></li>
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<li><a href="#item03">Future telephone conferences and f2f meetings / call time</a></li>
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<li><a href="#item04">Action items</a></li>
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<li><a href="#item05">Use case and requirements document structure</a></li>
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<li><a href="#item06">Features table from Ruben</a></li>
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<li><a href="#item07">Re-confirmation request from Daniel about the scope of our group</a></li>
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<li><a href="#item08">Layer structure discussion</a></li>
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</ol></li>
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<li><a href="#ActionSummary">Summary of Action Items</a></li>
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</ul><hr/><div class="meeting">
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<p class="irc"><<cite>frank</cite>> hello everybody - frank on irc only</p>
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<h3 id="item01">Agenda review / approval of previous minutes</h3>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> I am on the call, can you hear me ? probably mic is
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some problmatic via skype...</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> felix: Joakim became co-chair</p>
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<p class="phone"><a href="http://www.w3.org/2008/11/18-mediaann-minutes.html"
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>http://www.w3.org/2008/11/18-mediaann-minutes.html</a></p>
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<p class="phone"><a
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href="http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2008Nov/0124.html">
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http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2008Nov/0124.html</a></p>
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<p class="phone">minutes approved</p>
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<h3 id="item02">Selection of scribe for next meeting</h3>
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<p class="phone">handle via mail</p>
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<p class="phone">Future telephone conferences and f2f meetings / call time</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> Next call 2 December</p>
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<h3 id="item03">Future telephone conferences and f2f meetings / call time</h3>
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<p class="phone"><a
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href="http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/wiki/Meeting_Agenda_Ghentf2f_2008">
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http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/wiki/Meeting_Agenda_Ghentf2f_2008</a></p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> Felix plan to update agenda in next two weeks</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> +1</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> can we ask who will be participating this upcoming
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f2f on the IRC ?</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> Update agenda on Wiki if you miss something</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> my mic is not working...:-(</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Ruben</cite>> I will participate on the IRC</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>DrErnie</cite>> What's the date/ time zone for the F2F meeting?</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>cgi-irc</cite>> I will participate on IRC</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> I will</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>tobiasb</cite>> I will be in Ghent</p>
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<p class="phone">I will</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>davy</cite>> I will also be in Ghent</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>wonsuk</cite>> I will</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>DrErnie</cite>> sorry, too early for me. :-)</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>pchampin</cite>> not sure yet</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>pchampin</cite>> if I do, that will be on IRC</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>frank</cite>> I will be in Ghent too</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Ruben</cite>> Victor will be in Ghent representing the "UPC gang"</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> +1</p>
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<h3 id="item04">Action items</h3>
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<p class="phone"><a href="http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/track/actions/open">
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http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/track/actions/open</a></p>
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<p class="phone">ACTION-20 - ongoing</p>
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<p class="phone">ACTION-22 - ongoing, waiting for Karen</p>
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<p class="phone">ACTION-32</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> not yet, I will do asap</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>scribe</cite>> ongoing</p>
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<p class="phone">ACTION-33 - ongoing</p>
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<p class="phone">close ACTION-37</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>trackbot</cite>> ACTION-37 Write a mail about the general
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structure of the use cases / req document closed</p>
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<p class="phone">close ACTION-38</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>trackbot</cite>> ACTION-38 Draft a first agenda for the f2f
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meeting closed</p>
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<p class="phone">close ACTION-39</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>trackbot</cite>> ACTION-39 Put description about transmission cc
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in Wiki closed</p>
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<p class="phone">close ACTION-40</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>trackbot</cite>> ACTION-40 to send around an exemple of what she
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means with "plugging into complex model" closed</p>
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<p class="phone">close ACTION-41</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>trackbot</cite>> ACTION-41 Look into the MPEG API closed</p>
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<h3 id="item05">Use case and requirements document structure</h3>
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<p class="phone"><a
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href="http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2008Nov/0100.html">
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http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2008Nov/0100.html</a></p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>veronique</cite>> it is fine with me</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>pchampin</cite>> +1</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> +1</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Ruben</cite>> +1</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> +1</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>wonsuk</cite>> +1</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>tobiasb</cite>> +1</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>veronique</cite>> the structure wold be clear</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>davy</cite>> +1</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> one think that I have a direction is to make a
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usecase&req draft as simple as possible</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> Veronique can make the change to new documetn
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strucutre</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>veronique</cite>> Me and Wonsuk will change the structure</p>
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<h3 id="item06">Features table from Ruben</h3>
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<p class="phone"><a href="http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/wiki/FeaturesTable">
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http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/wiki/FeaturesTable</a></p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> Lets spend time on document during f2f</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>frank</cite>> +1</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> it's very useful. yes we will be able to spend much
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time for this discussion in Ghent</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> Ruben commented the feature table</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>pchampin</cite>> I think a line may be missing from the table</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> The table can serve as a template for everyone to
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edit</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> One line might be missing: the issue of annotating
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fragments</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> Or is it realted to the Media fragments group?</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>veronique</cite>> are there description properties that are valid
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only for fragments of media documents?</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Ruben</cite>> like SegmentDecomposition in MPEG-7</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> Ruben thinks media fragments should be considered</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> Identify fragments such as charcaters or an emotion
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in a scene</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Ruben</cite>> Well I did not say that, I'm just trying to
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understand Pierre-A...</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> exchange metdata independent of the media</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> Pierre-Antoine Champin will summerize his thoughts</p>
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<h3 id="item07">Re-confirmation request from Daniel about the scope of our group</h3>
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<p class="phone"><a
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href="http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2008Nov/0111.html">
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http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2008Nov/0111.html</a></p>
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<p class="phone">"The main focus of our group is video. We are also looking into other</p>
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<p class="phone">multimedia vocabularies, including ID3. However, I cannot tell (yet) to</p>
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<p class="phone">what extend these will be taken into account."</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> my thought is. video (and partially audio) is
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in-scope, music/image/text is out-of scope, any thoughts ?</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> sorry, I can't speak out using mic yet...pls be
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patient</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>veronique</cite>> why would image and music be out of scope
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(particularly if audio is in scope)..</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>frank</cite>> what daniel wants to say is: we focus on temporal
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media only?</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>veronique</cite>> I agree with video as a priority</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> Felix: Video is in the center, but we might take
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other modalities into account</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>frank</cite>> audio should really be in there</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>veronique</cite>> but audio and images standards are quite close
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on some aspects</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>veronique</cite>> that's why I do not see images as "out of scope"</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> just trying to make a clear definition of *video*</p>
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<p class="phone"><cite>joakim:</cite> think we should also images into account, since there
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are many image files available. Would be not good to disregard them</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> I agree with Joakim's concern, yeah seems to be
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also complex. I'd propose an email discussion on the list later. I will post</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> OK, after email discussion, then I will wrap up
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that and go to f2f</p>
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<h3 id="item08">Layer structure discussion</h3>
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<p class="phone"><a
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href="http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/wiki/Flat_syntax_for_structured_model">
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http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/wiki/Flat_syntax_for_structured_model</a></p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> P-A: Inorder to decide if we need strucutre or flat
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model we should construct a conceptual model first</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> We should decide if we need a syntax</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> in that case keep the syntax simple</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> We need a mixture of structured and flat model</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> A conceptual model could help avoiding repeating
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propoerties</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> we deicde based on the use case document</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>>
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<a href="http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/wiki/MXM"
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>http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/wiki/MXM</a></p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Ruben</cite>> Victor is not here</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> yeah, victor is not here, so let's move that on the
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mailing list or next call</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>>
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<a href="http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/wiki/TXFeed"
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>http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/wiki/TXFeed</a></p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>>
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<a href="http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/wiki/XMP"
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>http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/wiki/XMP</a></p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> XMP review will be part of f2f agenda.</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>>
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<a href="http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2008Nov/0097.html">
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http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2008Nov/0097.html</a></p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> Flickr machine tags are interesting because they
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are flat</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> Not using a name space but a prefix</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>> Should we investigate flickr machines tags closer?</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>>
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<a href="http://dev.w3.org/2008/video/mediaann/mediaont-req/mediaont-req.html">
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http://dev.w3.org/2008/video/mediaann/mediaont-req/mediaont-req.html</a></p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>veronique</cite>> the approach sounds interesting, even if images
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are not the primary focus of the WG</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> are somebody take this as a new ACTION ITEM ?</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>pchampin</cite>> i can do that</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> good,</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>joakim</cite>>
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<a href="http://dev.w3.org/2008/video/mediaann/mediaont-api-1.0/mediaont-api-1.0.html">
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http://dev.w3.org/2008/video/mediaann/mediaont-api-1.0/mediaont-api-1.0.html</a></p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> ok, it's just boilerplate issue</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> last question before closing</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> are you all ok this call time ?</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>veronique</cite>> well, it is quite late here...</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>wonsuk</cite>> It's very early to me.</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> I saw may regrets since it's too late...what do you
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think ? shall we change ?</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> OK, Joakim and myself will make some alternative
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for the call time</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>veronique</cite>> but there has been a vote about this schedule,
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no?</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>veronique</cite>> ok</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> we can vote our schedule whenever we want...:-)</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> thanks, and see you next call</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Ruben</cite>> Bye</p>
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<p class="irc"><<cite>Daniel</cite>> minutes draft</p>
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</div><h2><a name="ActionSummary" id="ActionSummary">Summary of Action
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Items</a></h2><!-- Action Items --> [End of minutes]<br/><hr/><address> Minutes formatted by
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David Booth's <a href="http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm">
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scribe.perl</a> version 1.133 (<a href="http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/">CVS
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log</a>)<br/> $Date: 2008/12/02 14:25:26 $ </address></body>
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