You can not select more than 25 topics
Topics must start with a letter or number, can include dashes ('-') and can be up to 35 characters long.
1042 lines
33 KiB
1042 lines
33 KiB
<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//EN"
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-transitional.dtd">
|
|
|
|
<html lang='en' xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" xml:lang="en">
|
|
<head>
|
|
<meta name="generator" content=
|
|
"HTML Tidy for Linux/x86 (vers 12 April 2005), see www.w3.org" />
|
|
|
|
<title>Social Web Incubator Group Teleconference -- 07 Oct
|
|
2009</title>
|
|
<link type="text/css" rel="STYLESHEET" href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/StyleSheets/base.css" />
|
|
<link type="text/css" rel="STYLESHEET" href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/StyleSheets/public.css" />
|
|
<link type="text/css" rel="STYLESHEET" href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2004/02/minutes-style.css" />
|
|
<meta content="Social Web Incubator Group Teleconference" name=
|
|
"Title" />
|
|
<meta content="text/html; charset=utf-8" http-equiv=
|
|
"Content-Type" />
|
|
</head>
|
|
|
|
<body>
|
|
<p><a href="http://www.w3.org/"><img src=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/Icons/w3c_home" alt="W3C" border="0" height=
|
|
"48" width="72" /></a></p>
|
|
|
|
<h1>Social Web Incubator Group Teleconference</h1>
|
|
|
|
<h2>07 Oct 2009</h2>
|
|
|
|
<p>See also: <a href="http://www.w3.org/2009/10/07-swxg-irc">IRC
|
|
log</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<h2><a name="attendees" id="attendees">Attendees</a></h2>
|
|
|
|
<div class="intro">
|
|
<dl>
|
|
<dt>Present</dt>
|
|
|
|
<dd> Adam AlexPassant CaptSolo Carine DKA FabGandon MacTed OpenLink_Software alex bblfish caribou cperey danbri evanpro hhalpin joined melvster mischat pchampin petef rreck tinkster trackbot yuk</dd>
|
|
|
|
<dt>Regrets</dt>
|
|
|
|
<dd>Andrea</dd>
|
|
|
|
<dt>Chair</dt>
|
|
|
|
<dd>hhalpin</dd>
|
|
|
|
<dt>Scribe</dt>
|
|
|
|
<dd>peterf</dd>
|
|
</dl>
|
|
</div>
|
|
|
|
<h2>Contents</h2>
|
|
|
|
<ul>
|
|
<li><a href="#agenda">Topics</a></li>
|
|
|
|
<li><a href="#ActionSummary">Summary of Action Items</a></li>
|
|
</ul>
|
|
<hr />
|
|
|
|
<div class="meeting">
|
|
<p class='phone'> </p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'> </p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Date: 07 October
|
|
2009</p>
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Convene SWXG WG
|
|
meeting of 2009-10-07T15:00-17:00Z</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> scribe: peterf</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> PROPOSED: to
|
|
approve SWXG WG Weekly -- 30th September 2009 as a true
|
|
record</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> RESOLVED: approved
|
|
SWXG WG Weekly -- 30th September 2009 as a true record</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tinkster</cite>> evanpro, when you
|
|
call in, we're on extension 26632 instead of 7994.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> PROPOSED: to meet
|
|
again Wed. October 14th</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> 2. General
|
|
Organization</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> TPAC, IIW</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/Planning_for_TPAC_Open_Day">
|
|
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/Planning_for_TPAC_Open_Day</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> TPAC?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> I imagine go a
|
|
few...</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Hoping to have an
|
|
"Open Day"</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> but it conflicts
|
|
with OAuth/OpenID Summit, which is also on Monday 2nd.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> you are scribing?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> This is at
|
|
Yahoo.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> do you have a URL
|
|
for the openid oauth summit?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>I'm happy if you are.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://openid.eventbrite.com/">http://openid.eventbrite.com/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Petef - please
|
|
scribe!</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>OK</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tinkster</cite>> petef, hhalpin
|
|
likes to type up everything he says to prevent himself from
|
|
being misquoted.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> I try to type dates
|
|
and stuff...</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>dka my initial view was we should have the
|
|
open day anyway</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>evanpro</cite>> Seems like there'd
|
|
be great synergy to have them complementary events</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>[please tell me if I am missing scribing
|
|
protocol]</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>dka but now think maybe we should cancel the
|
|
openday</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>and work with the openid thing</p>
|
|
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>thanks guys</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>dka:</cite> should we just forget about
|
|
it?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> how about Tue at the
|
|
Marriot?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> Well I can get Sun
|
|
on Tuesday too</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>cperey</cite>> what about later in
|
|
the week?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> not too many people
|
|
registered</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>dka:</cite> we could invite people to
|
|
observe our working group<br />
|
|
... unless we could get externally parties in to present, like
|
|
on the calls</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> we could invite people
|
|
Michelle Adamic (sp?) has a list of names we could invite</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>cperey</cite>> many apologies but
|
|
what about having Open Day on another day?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>cperey</cite>> later in week?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>evanpro</cite>> two days close
|
|
together please</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>evanpro</cite>> I would attend if
|
|
both events were close together</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>evanpro</cite>> A week apart makes
|
|
things hard for out-of-towners</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>cperey</cite>> Henry</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>Thanks</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> So the question is
|
|
how many people would be able to come on Monday?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>henry:</cite> it's only an openid
|
|
meeting, we aren't expecting any new announcements</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> there are three
|
|
confilcting events</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> My concern was
|
|
two-fold: first, conflicting events might be misinterpreted by
|
|
OpenID/OAuth folks</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> there is Apache
|
|
conf</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> there is IIW</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>cperey</cite>> New proposal: what
|
|
about having an Open Day when there are not conflicting
|
|
events?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> there is W3C
|
|
conf</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Any ideas?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>cperey</cite>> early Dec?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>cperey</cite>> I mean completely
|
|
separate</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>cperey:</cite> I could take an action
|
|
item to propose other dates at anoher location, not TPAC</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> ok, then the
|
|
problem is that a lot of people won't be out there</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> anymore</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>dka:</cite> I won't be out in the Bay
|
|
area again for a while<br />
|
|
... part of the idea of doing it at TPAC was to leverage
|
|
people's attendance<br />
|
|
... could we do a hybrid event with the openid folk?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> sounds good too</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>dka:</cite> half a day on each<br />
|
|
... is that a middle way that would satisfy everybody?<br />
|
|
... if so we could start drafting a page around that and get it
|
|
out to people</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> My question is can
|
|
we just get these people to get to TPAC - i.e. TPAC into an
|
|
"open day"</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Assuming very few
|
|
people are coming</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> I think I agree
|
|
with that</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> how many people can
|
|
come to OpenDay?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>dka:</cite> concerned that we may not be
|
|
able to network a largish event at short notice</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> the IIW will be all
|
|
week?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>hhalpin?: won't people also be attending
|
|
IIW?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> sorry I mean they
|
|
will be all week</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>dka:</cite> we want to make sure we
|
|
aren't stepping on any toes<br />
|
|
... seen as trying to put on a competing event<br />
|
|
... but if we could get some CTOs and mktg consultants into
|
|
TPAc that would be good</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> we need to move on</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>cperey</cite>> yep, meeting
|
|
after</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>cperey</cite>> henry you are
|
|
breaking up</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>evanpro</cite>> petef, 514-554-3826
|
|
== me</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>cperey</cite>> haha!</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tinkster</cite>> danbri: we're not
|
|
in 2994.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>dka:</cite> evan is on the line, let's
|
|
make the most of his time</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>evanpro:</cite> I'm enjoying
|
|
listening</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tinkster</cite>> we're in 26632</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Adam</cite>> 26632 is the new code
|
|
dan</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>dka:</cite> we'll go straight to... the
|
|
invited guests</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> 3. Invited Guest -
|
|
Evan Prodromou from OpenMicroBlogging and Alex Passant on
|
|
Semantic Microblogging</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Evan?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>evanpro</cite>> I'm here</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Evan Prodromou of
|
|
OpenMicroblogging will give a talk on his work on
|
|
OpenMicroblogging (see the specification) and its connection to
|
|
the wider Social Web ecoystem</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>dka:</cite> hopefully evanpro can give
|
|
us an interesting introduction to OMB</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>evanpro:</cite> a conjunction of openid,
|
|
oauth and swxg would be enough to get me out to CA<br />
|
|
... I am the inventor and shepherd of OMB<br />
|
|
... bg on myself - working on open source and content for 15
|
|
yrs</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>esp wikitravel</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>around issues of identity</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://evan.prodromou.name/">http://evan.prodromou.name/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>briefly on JSF Council</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://identi.ca/evan">http://identi.ca/evan</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>with the launch of Twitter in 2007</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>there was an expolsion of interest in OMB</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>defined as exchange of small text message with
|
|
your social network</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>twitter, jaiku, pownce etc.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>contrast to blogging , tumblelogs and social
|
|
bookmarking</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>people seem to enjoy OMB and the
|
|
responsiveness of it</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>as the growth of witter got ahead of their
|
|
ability to support it</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>interest grew in the evolution of an open
|
|
standard for microblogging (OMB)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>seeing as noone else was doing it I thought I
|
|
would set up an easy hack</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>federated</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>started laconica in May 2008, hosting
|
|
identi.ca</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>includes features important to the future of
|
|
the open social web</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>openid, foaf, import and export of data</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>you can take the identi.ca source and install
|
|
it in silo</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>so decided to create a protocol</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>my design criteria were</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>http based system</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>tend to go for the low end on servers</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>so that you could install a node on commodity
|
|
shared hosting</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>wanted it to work with openid and oauth</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>and to be realtively easy to implement with
|
|
existing tools and libraries</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>flirted with openid attrib exchange</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> cf <a href=
|
|
"http://openid.net/specs/openid-attribute-exchange-1_0.html">http://openid.net/specs/openid-attribute-exchange-1_0.html</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>but the mechanics don't allow pushing and
|
|
pulling to other openid servers</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>so wouldn't really work</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>instead used oauth</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>subscribing to somebody's notices means that
|
|
you authorise another server to push to your inbox</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>four players:</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>publisher, subscriber, publiher-server,
|
|
subscriber-server</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>profiles within OMB are http urls</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>subscriber provides their url to the publisher
|
|
server</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>which uses oauth discovery</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>still very fluid</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>OMB uses XRD simple files</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>draft since deprecated for LRDD</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>will share links later</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>use oauth discovery to find endpoints</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>two additional endpoints are defined</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>the user experience is to go through the
|
|
typically oauth dance</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>token exchange</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>unlike some other pubsub mechanisms</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>there's an expectation that I should know who
|
|
subscribes to my feed</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>closer relationship</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>pass along profile info in oauth dance</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>avatar, full name, location, homepage, short
|
|
bio</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>via http post params</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>once sub complete</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>the two additional endpoints are used</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>push based (unlike atom or rss)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>no polling</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>good responsiveness, better performance</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>post notice endpoint</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>used by pulisher server</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>profile update endpoint</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>used if publisher profile chganges</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>any kind of client to server api is out of
|
|
scope</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>laconica (now called status net) uses a clone
|
|
of the twitter api</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>also working on an atompub version</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>any kind of syntax def'n is also out of
|
|
scope</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Adam</cite>> the pub/sub
|
|
explanation sounds very similar to pubsubhubhub</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>just pushes plain text</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>hashtags #foo and directed messages @bar are
|
|
not defined in OMB</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>0.1 protocol has been fairly successful</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>thousands of nodes on the network</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>important weaknesses</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>no system for unsolicited notices</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>if you aren't subscribed to me no way for me
|
|
to message you</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tinkster1</cite>> Adam, it sort of
|
|
is, but there's no hub per se. Updates are pushed from
|
|
publisher server to subscriber server.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>parsing syntax left out which means the
|
|
hashtags and replies have to be guessed at</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>threading questions across multiple
|
|
servers</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>no threading bult in</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>no direct private messages eiother</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>low level thing, in oauth two kinds of keys -
|
|
one to identify a particular conversation and one for th
|
|
sending server -</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>OMB actually uses the root URL of the sending
|
|
server</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>hard to verify in the client</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>I'd like to talk about where we are going with
|
|
OMB 0.2</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>four other implementations:</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>openmicroblogger, jaiku (at 0.2), etc.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>for 0.2 biggest change is move away from plain
|
|
text to atom entries for pushing notices</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>richer data format</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>DKA</cite>> NB: In Vodafone we are
|
|
already using laconi.ca for an internal microblog system and we
|
|
are looking at using it as a platform for building mobile
|
|
social network prototype apps.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>we'll also e able to leverage work around
|
|
activitystreams</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>which is also atom based</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://activitystrea.ms/">http://activitystrea.ms/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> (aside: they're
|
|
moving this to be equally atom and json)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>second important thing is we will include
|
|
parsed html</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>some security issues obviously</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>will require sanitizing</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>but good step for usability</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>adding in-reply-to info</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>will improve threading</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>@xyz will resolve to an identity url for the
|
|
recipient</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>that will travel with the packet</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>replacing oauth discovery with LRDD</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>support for unsolicited messages</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>in protocol, up to clients what they do with
|
|
it</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>proposal to provision verifiable user keys</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>[tinkster I'll get it right eventually]</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>we want something interoperable by the end of
|
|
the year</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>relation to openid</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>OMB identity is an URL</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>use YADIS</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>want to make sure we mesh nicely with
|
|
openid</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>two new feed based systems announced</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> bradfitz</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> fitzpatrick</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>pubsubhubbub</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>atom based</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PubSubHubbub">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PubSubHubbub</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>and rsscloud</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>embedded into rss 2.0 but never really
|
|
implemented</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>now being revived</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>neither supports feeding back subscriber
|
|
relation to publisher</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>we are implementing both of these and trying
|
|
to work with the standards to add in subscriber publisher
|
|
feedback</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>activity streams - the hard part will be the
|
|
unification between AS, atom and opensocial</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>always wanted http based system</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>but would also like an upshift to xmpp based
|
|
if both servers support it</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>well known protocol, very nice pubsub
|
|
system</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>some work done to adapt it for OMB</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>looking into that</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>stubs for that in 0.2</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>discovery process over the next few months</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>+q</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Zakim</cite>> danbri, you wanted to
|
|
ask if anyone has done usability testing on OMB remote
|
|
subscription scenarios</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> peterf first</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>petef:</cite> have you looked at
|
|
wave-protocol in relation to OM</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>B</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>evanpro:</cite> v. intersting but ow it
|
|
will fit into OMB is still open</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> ok i fixed my audio,
|
|
i'm next on queue please :)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>for low end target systems wave won't be
|
|
available for quite a while</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>whether it picks up as ubiquitous will be
|
|
interesting</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>my hope is that it does see some success</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>don't think the current generation fits well
|
|
with OMB</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tinkster1</cite>> yes</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>interested in wave and how it develops</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tinkster1</cite>> no longer
|
|
audible</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> you were audiable</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>DKA</cite>> losing part of danbri's
|
|
speech</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> q:</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> have you done any
|
|
usability testing</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> esp on remote
|
|
subscribe aspects of OMB</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> do users understand
|
|
what's going on, etc</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>evanpro:</cite> usability testing -
|
|
pretty important usability problems</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>v. similar to usability problems for
|
|
openid</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>mechanism is very similar</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>I need to remember my identity url</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> cf <a href=
|
|
"http://lists.openid.net/pipermail/openid-user-experience/">http://lists.openid.net/pipermail/openid-user-experience/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>and provide it to remote servers which use it
|
|
to start a conversation on the back end</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>we haven't done much work on that</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>hopwe we can borrow from openid world</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> i'm interested to
|
|
see more work figuring out how much implies protocol design
|
|
changes, and how much can be done with improved web design,
|
|
addons etc</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>widgets and keeping an eye on webfinger</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://code.google.com/p/webfinger/">http://code.google.com/p/webfinger/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://hueniverse.com/2009/09/implementing-webfinger/">http://hueniverse.com/2009/09/implementing-webfinger/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>users associate people with email type
|
|
addresses</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>and urls with docs</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> thanks evanpro, ...
|
|
i think webfinger pretty relevant here</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://hueniverse.com/webfinger/">http://hueniverse.com/webfinger/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>webfinger also nice simple way to include
|
|
addresses into OMB msgs</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tinkster1</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://buzzword.org.uk/2009/fingerpoint/">http://buzzword.org.uk/2009/fingerpoint/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>passive subscription</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> """What Problem is
|
|
WebFinger Trying to Solve? ... WebFinger is trying to address
|
|
the lack of adoption and usability of current HTTP-URI-based
|
|
user identifier solutions, most notably OpenID. """</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>would speed things up and improve
|
|
usability</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>could also happen with a global directory,
|
|
although there are concerns about recentralisation</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> (so maybe some role
|
|
for <a href=
|
|
"http://code.google.com/apis/socialgraph/">http://code.google.com/apis/socialgraph/</a>
|
|
etc ?)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Zakim</cite>> AlexPassant, you
|
|
wanted to discuss synergies with SMOB / SIOC and other
|
|
vocabs</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> skypish sounds</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>alex(?): very brief overview of SMOB (audio
|
|
not clear)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>wondering how it relates to OMB</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tinkster1</cite>> Alex, StatusNet
|
|
already published FOAF, RSS and SIOC data.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>AlexPassant</cite>> SMOB: <a href=
|
|
"http://smob.sioc-project.org/">http://smob.sioc-project.org/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>evanpro:</cite> we support sioc(?)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tinkster1</cite>> s/shark/SIOC/</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> SIOC is pronounced
|
|
like Shark, yes</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> (irish word)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>doesn't address server to server mechanism</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>CaptSolo</cite>> danbri: commonly
|
|
pronounced as "shock"</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>similar to smtp</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>SMOB does a good job of keeping your published
|
|
info and pushing it out</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>but not really server to server
|
|
interaction</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> (shark is commonly
|
|
pronounced 'shock' in some countries too ;)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>wouldn't be a big leap to implement OMB in
|
|
SMOB</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>would be very welcome</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>CaptSolo</cite>> danbri: the proper
|
|
irish pronounciation is similar to "shuck" and means frost
|
|
(imagine social networks connecting together like snowflakes or
|
|
frost on a window)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>OMB doesn't (yet) cover sharing the social
|
|
graph</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>you can use other mechanisms, through FOAF
|
|
say,</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tinkster1</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://chatlogs.planetrdf.com/swig/2009-10-07.html#T11-56-51">http://chatlogs.planetrdf.com/swig/2009-10-07.html#T11-56-51</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>might be nice to promote it or provide an
|
|
url</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>as part of profile info passed through</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>SMOB is cool, would love to see it brought
|
|
together with OMB</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>alex:</cite> more than happy to work
|
|
together</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>evanpro:</cite> one of our devs took the
|
|
OMB stuff out of staus net and turned it into a WP plugin and a
|
|
PHP library</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tinkster1</cite>> you're breaking
|
|
up</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> did we have DKA's
|
|
question yet?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> how are you using
|
|
FOAF?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>DKA</cite>> nope</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>DKA</cite>> :)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> w: are you making
|
|
use of foaf to do something</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tinkster1</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://identi.ca/tobyink/foaf">http://identi.ca/tobyink/foaf</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>evanpro:</cite> we provided FOAF info
|
|
and use FOAF ids in graph</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>toby has been great in helping us implement
|
|
that and the SIOC stuff better</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> try putting <a href=
|
|
"http://identi.ca/danbri">http://identi.ca/danbri</a> into
|
|
<a href=
|
|
"http://socialgraph-resources.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/samples/exploreapi.html">
|
|
http://socialgraph-resources.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/samples/exploreapi.html</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> google sgapi indexes
|
|
identi.ca foaf</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>Could use FOAF for profile exchange in OMB</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>makes more sense for discovery and so
|
|
usability</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>who should I follow?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>who might I kalready know?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> poss foaf use cases
|
|
'what kind of people should i be subscribing to, who sohuld i
|
|
follow, who is there that i know, ...'</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> (i think also around
|
|
groups, ...)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>groups is another great case</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>there's going to be a close interaction
|
|
between OMB and FOAF</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tinkster1</cite>> SELECT ?person
|
|
WHERE { ?me subscribesTo ?x , ?y . ?x subscribesTo ?person . ?y
|
|
subscribesTo ?person . FILTER (?x != ?y) }</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> evanpro, if there
|
|
are tweaks you need to foaf to support any of these use cases,
|
|
... that's not so hard to arrange!</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>dka:</cite> we are limited on time</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> i've already had a
|
|
question so i'll take it to email!</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> a-</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>dka:</cite> are you thinking about
|
|
making lcation part of the platform</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> (my q was basically
|
|
<a href=
|
|
"http://lists.status.net/pipermail/statusnet-dev/2009-August/002117.html">
|
|
http://lists.status.net/pipermail/statusnet-dev/2009-August/002117.html</a>
|
|
again)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>one reason many of us use Jaiku is the
|
|
sophisticated support for location</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>evanpro:</cite> fascinating that we are
|
|
reintroducing location to the web</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>in OMB 0.1 we only have a points tring
|
|
associated with a profile</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>if I update it, that can change (but would be
|
|
lost)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>making changes to staus net to support a
|
|
richer more machine friendly location format</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>will be out in 0.9 later this month</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tinkster1</cite>> geonames
|
|
IIRC?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>lat long and geo place name vocab</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>where on earth, geonames, OSM</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>we will also include location info for each
|
|
notice</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>AlexPassant</cite>> sounds along
|
|
the lines of the linkage we're doing in SMOB with geonames and
|
|
DBpedia, great synergies</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>would make sense to get it into OMB 0.2</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>optional but important</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>moving to atom - should be easily included in
|
|
atom entries</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> (<a href=
|
|
"http://status.net/trac/report/6">http://status.net/trac/report/6</a>
|
|
seems interesting to poke around...)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>evanpro:</cite> would love to attend
|
|
open day, thanks for having me on the call</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> evanpro - will stay
|
|
in touch via e-mail, and thanks so much for being on call!</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>dka:</cite> thank you</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> thanks evanpro!</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>dka:</cite> we have to close the call
|
|
now<br />
|
|
... we need tocome up with a plan for the openday offline by
|
|
tomorrow<br />
|
|
... how to mesh with SWXG workshop, openid and oauth</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Oh, can we have an
|
|
ACTION by someone</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> to summarize that
|
|
call?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>pchampin</cite>> bye</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>AlexPassant</cite>> thanks, bye</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tinkster</cite>> I can
|
|
summarise</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>DKA</cite>> good point harry -</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> thanks
|
|
tinkster!</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> way to go
|
|
tinkster</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>DKA</cite>> :)</p><a name=
|
|
"action01" id="action01"></a>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>>
|
|
<strong>ACTION:</strong> tinkster to summarize Evan's talk
|
|
[recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2009/10/07-swxg-minutes.html#action02">http://www.w3.org/2009/10/07-swxg-minutes.html#action02</a>]</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Created ACTION-96
|
|
- Summarize Evan's talk [on Toby Inkster - due
|
|
2009-10-14].</p><a name="action03" id="action03"></a>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>DKA</cite>> :)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Dan - do you really
|
|
want to do it, or tinkster?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>DKA</cite>> If tinkster can do it
|
|
that would be great.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> OK, will delete
|
|
that from the minutes then...</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tinkster</cite>> I'm happy to.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>DKA</cite>> thanks toby!</p>
|
|
</div>
|
|
|
|
<h2><a name="ActionSummary" id="ActionSummary">Summary of Action
|
|
Items</a></h2><!-- Action Items -->
|
|
|
|
<strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> tinkster to
|
|
summarize Evan's talk [recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2009/10/07-swxg-minutes.html#action02">http://www.w3.org/2009/10/07-swxg-minutes.html#action02</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<br />
|
|
[End of minutes]<br />
|
|
<hr />
|
|
|
|
<address>
|
|
Minutes formatted by David Booth's <a href=
|
|
"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm">
|
|
scribe.perl</a> version 1.135 (<a href=
|
|
"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/">CVS log</a>)<br />
|
|
$Date: 2009/10/08 15:51:23 $
|
|
</address>
|
|
|
|
</body>
|
|
</html>
|