You can not select more than 25 topics
Topics must start with a letter or number, can include dashes ('-') and can be up to 35 characters long.
1138 lines
45 KiB
1138 lines
45 KiB
<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//EN"
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-transitional.dtd">
|
|
|
|
<html lang='en' xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" xml:lang="en">
|
|
<head>
|
|
<meta name="generator" content=
|
|
"HTML Tidy for Linux/x86 (vers 12 April 2005), see www.w3.org" />
|
|
|
|
<title>Media Fragments Working Group Teleconference -- 09 Dec
|
|
2008</title>
|
|
<link type="text/css" rel="STYLESHEET" href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/StyleSheets/base.css" />
|
|
<link type="text/css" rel="STYLESHEET" href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/StyleSheets/public.css" />
|
|
<link type="text/css" rel="STYLESHEET" href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2004/02/minutes-style.css" />
|
|
<meta content="Media Fragments Working Group Teleconference"
|
|
name="Title" />
|
|
<meta content="text/html; charset=utf-8" http-equiv=
|
|
"Content-Type" />
|
|
</head>
|
|
|
|
<body>
|
|
<p><a href="http://www.w3.org/"><img src=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/Icons/w3c_home" alt="W3C" border="0" height=
|
|
"48" width="72" /></a></p>
|
|
|
|
<h1>- DRAFT -</h1>
|
|
|
|
<h1>Media Fragments Working Group Teleconference</h1>
|
|
|
|
<h2>09 Dec 2008</h2>
|
|
|
|
<p><a href=
|
|
'http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/SecondF2FAgenda'>Agenda</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p>See also: <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-irc">IRC log</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<h2><a name="attendees" id="attendees">Attendees</a></h2>
|
|
|
|
<div class="intro">
|
|
<dl>
|
|
<dt>Present</dt>
|
|
|
|
<dd>Yves, Frank, Davy, Erik, Raphael, Tom,
|
|
Silvia_(remote)</dd>
|
|
|
|
<dt>Regrets</dt>
|
|
|
|
<dt>Chair</dt>
|
|
|
|
<dd>Erik, Raphael</dd>
|
|
|
|
<dt>Scribe</dt>
|
|
|
|
<dd>raphael, erik</dd>
|
|
</dl>
|
|
</div>
|
|
|
|
<h2>Contents</h2>
|
|
|
|
<ul>
|
|
<li>
|
|
<a href="#agenda">Topics</a>
|
|
|
|
<ol>
|
|
<li><a href="#item01">1. Admin</a></li>
|
|
|
|
<li><a href="#item02">2. Discussion Existing
|
|
Technologies</a></li>
|
|
|
|
<li><a href="#item03">3. Define Types of
|
|
Addressing</a></li>
|
|
|
|
<li><a href="#item04">4. Implementation Issues (protocol
|
|
& caching)</a></li>
|
|
|
|
<li><a href="#item05">5. Joint Session with Media
|
|
Annotations WG</a></li>
|
|
|
|
<li><a href="#item06">joint meeting MF & MA</a></li>
|
|
</ol>
|
|
</li>
|
|
|
|
<li><a href="#ActionSummary">Summary of Action Items</a></li>
|
|
</ul>
|
|
<hr />
|
|
|
|
<div class="meeting">
|
|
<p class='phone'> </p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'> </p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Date: 09 December
|
|
2008</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>raphael</cite>> scribenick:
|
|
raphael</p>
|
|
|
|
<h3 id="item01">1. Admin</h3>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>I would like we talk about the composition of
|
|
the group in order to know if more people/companies are about
|
|
to join</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>YouTube/Google Video: Ken Harrenstien is more
|
|
interested in Media Annotations</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>scribe:</cite> it would be interested to
|
|
have someone that has implemented fragments access</p><a name=
|
|
"action01" id="action01"></a>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>scribe</cite>>
|
|
<strong>ACTION:</strong> Yves to find out with Philippe who
|
|
from Google would be interested to join [recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action01">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action01</a>]</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Created ACTION-17
|
|
- Find out with Philippe who from Google would be interested to
|
|
join [on Yves Lafon - due 2008-12-16].</p><a name="action02"
|
|
id="action02"></a>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>scribe</cite>>
|
|
<strong>ACTION:</strong> Raphael to see with Marie Claire who
|
|
from Daily Motion can join [recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action02">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action02</a>]</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Sorry, couldn't
|
|
find user - Raphael</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Yves</cite>> ACTION-2 on Troncy</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Yves</cite>> ACTION-2 due December
|
|
16 2008</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> ACTION-2 Set up a
|
|
questionary for seond MediaFrag F2F in Gent (8. and 9. Dec) due
|
|
date now December 16 2008</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>Frank (Canon): it would be difficult for Canon
|
|
to join in 2009</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Adobe:</cite> Larry Masinter answered,
|
|
he has not yet someone to nominate in the group, but Adobe
|
|
supports strongly this group</p><a name="action03" id=
|
|
"action03"></a>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>scribe</cite>>
|
|
<strong>ACTION:</strong> Troncy to check with Karen about Blinx
|
|
joining or not W3C and Colm the WG [recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action03">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action03</a>]</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Created ACTION-19
|
|
- Check with Karen about Blinx joining or not W3C and Colm the
|
|
WG [on Raphaël Troncy - due 2008-12-16].</p><a name="action04"
|
|
id="action04"></a>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>scribe</cite>>
|
|
<strong>ACTION:</strong> Michael to check with Wolfgang whether
|
|
he is still interested in this WG [recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action04">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action04</a>]</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Created ACTION-20
|
|
- Check with Wolfgang whether he is still interested in this WG
|
|
[on Michael Hausenblas - due 2008-12-16].</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>nessy</cite>> I'm idling</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>nessy</cite>> will have go for 2
|
|
hours, but back then</p><a name="action05" id="action05"></a>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>scribe</cite>>
|
|
<strong>ACTION:</strong> Erik to check with Philippe the status
|
|
of Cisco (Paul Bosso), Apple (Dave Singer or Eric Carlson)
|
|
[recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action05">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action05</a>]</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Created ACTION-21
|
|
- Check with Philippe the status of Cisco (Paul Bosso), Apple
|
|
(Dave Singer or Eric Carlson) [on Erik Mannens - due
|
|
2008-12-16].</p><a name="action06" id="action06"></a>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>scribe</cite>>
|
|
<strong>ACTION:</strong> Raphael to check with Karen the status
|
|
of Fox Interactive, if they could have an interest in the group
|
|
[recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action06">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action06</a>]</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Sorry, couldn't
|
|
find user - Raphael</p><a name="action07" id="action07"></a>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Yves</cite>>
|
|
<strong>ACTION:</strong> Rapha�l to check with Karen the status
|
|
of Fox Interactive, if they could have an interest in the group
|
|
[recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action07">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action07</a>]</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Sorry, couldn't
|
|
find user - Rapha�l</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Erik:</cite> should we have a stronger
|
|
liaison with HTML5?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> we have work to do, it is
|
|
good to keep contact, but we could ask more feedback when we
|
|
have better documents<br />
|
|
... same for browser vendors</p>
|
|
|
|
<h3 id="item02">2. Discussion Existing Technologies</h3>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>On the wiki: <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Existing_Technologies_Survey">
|
|
http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Existing_Technologies_Survey</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>Tom (IBBT) going through the wiki</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>Presentation also available at: <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/meetings/2008-12-09-f2f_ghent/IBBT-State_of_the_art.pptx">
|
|
http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/meetings/2008-12-09-f2f_ghent/IBBT-State_of_the_art.pptx</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Tom:</cite> first explain what SMIL can
|
|
do (Jack will be here later today and tomorrow)<br />
|
|
... MPEG-7 (see slide 3)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> should we discuss the
|
|
format for representing the time point?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> you can adopt the ISO Dates
|
|
one, the XML Schema one<br />
|
|
... the MPEG-7 one is based on XML Schema, minus the Time Zone,
|
|
but adding the frame number</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Yves</cite>>
|
|
ttp://www.w3.org/2002/ws/databinding/edcopy/report/all.html</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Better:</cite> <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2002/ws/databinding/edcopy/report/all.html">http://www.w3.org/2002/ws/databinding/edcopy/report/all.html</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> we should say we consider
|
|
only time that is local to the media<br />
|
|
... so de don't care about time zones for example</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Tom:</cite> SVG has no temporal
|
|
fragment<br />
|
|
... TimedText: it shows text at a given time<br />
|
|
... seems to have another format for representing time
|
|
point<br />
|
|
... CMML derives from Annodex, it requires an off file that has
|
|
been annotated</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> Silvia points the problem
|
|
of accessing a given frame, if it is not an I-Fram</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Yves</cite>> (when referencing only
|
|
time)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> we can decide to always
|
|
go to the previous I-Frame, that precedes a time point</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Tom:</cite> CMML specifies time with
|
|
npt, smpte and clock</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> should we do the
|
|
same?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Tom:</cite> default seems to be npt</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> we come back to these
|
|
questions when Sivlia is on the phone</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Tom:</cite> CMML/Annodex/TemporalURI has
|
|
no spatial Fragment<br />
|
|
... can select Tracks (such as in a CD)<br />
|
|
... has the notion of naming a fragment and refer to this
|
|
name</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> is there an error in the
|
|
named fragment example? Should the '/' be escaped for selecting
|
|
the tracks 'a' and 'b' ?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Tom:</cite> MPEG-21 has 4 different
|
|
schemes (ffp, offset, mp, mask)<br />
|
|
... offset works in bytes range<br />
|
|
... mp scheme has the time dimension (npt, smpte, utc, mpeg-7)
|
|
and the spatial dimension (polygon, rectangle, elipse)<br />
|
|
... mask is similar to kind of naming a fragment<br />
|
|
... HTML5 (see slide 5)<br />
|
|
... no support for fragmentation or time reference (like in
|
|
SVG)<br />
|
|
... has Time Daatatypes: Date, Time, Date and Time, Time Zones
|
|
(UTC: add a Z at the end; others: add time difference to UTC
|
|
with + or -)<br />
|
|
... values come from XML Schema (perhaps with one small
|
|
difference, since the seconds can be omitted)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> go through the spatial
|
|
fragments specifications (image maps, MPEG-7, SVG)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Erik:</cite> how this technological
|
|
survey be used ?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> we will provide either
|
|
informally or in the spec a mapping between the URI schem and
|
|
these various XML syntaxes</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> Since we want a URI scheme,
|
|
we will not support everything we have seen, but the maximal
|
|
possible subset</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>nessy</cite>> back now</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rtroncy</cite>> Silvia, we have a
|
|
number of questions for you :-)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>Question 1: We reviewed <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Existing_Technologies_Survey#CMML">
|
|
http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Existing_Technologies_Survey#CMML</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>scribe:</cite> we wonder if there is not
|
|
a mistake in the URI example, and if the '/' should not be
|
|
escaped</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> first we use a '-' and
|
|
then move to '/'</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Yves</cite>> in the examples on
|
|
CMML, the / after the ? should be escaped</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Yves</cite>> => %2f</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> I think it is ok to have
|
|
the '/' in the fragment ('#') but not for the query ('?')</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>Silvia will check whether there is a syntax
|
|
error or not</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>Question 2: CMML covered 3 schemes for
|
|
representing time point: npt, smpte and clock</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> should we do the
|
|
same?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> we wanted to be
|
|
interoperable with all formats<br />
|
|
... in practice, people tend to use the 'npt' scheme<br />
|
|
... maybe it is better to talk with video professionals<br />
|
|
... they need to access the frame level<br />
|
|
... I think that for most use cases, the npt scheme is accurate
|
|
enough<br />
|
|
... npt is the default scheme in CMML<br />
|
|
... don't confuse: ntp, the network time protocol (unix) and
|
|
npt, what we are discussing<br />
|
|
... npt = normal playback time</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> Question 3: Frame
|
|
access, should we always go to the last I-Frame that precedes
|
|
the time point we want to access</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> depends on the what the
|
|
codecs allows<br />
|
|
... with Theora, we jump to always to the previous
|
|
I-Frame<br />
|
|
... we need to be accurate when we store the fragment (cache),
|
|
it seems less important on the client side</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Davy:</cite> I agree with Silvia, we
|
|
might want to provide some guidelines for some specific
|
|
formats<br />
|
|
... we cannot define an algorithm that says that a time point
|
|
corresponds to a particual frame for all encoding cases, it's
|
|
not possible</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> we can say that previous
|
|
I-Frame is accurate enough</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> what the cache will
|
|
finally store?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> Cache will store what the
|
|
servers is serving, and recompose fragments based on bytes, not
|
|
using the URI requested by the UA</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>davy</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/HTTP_implementation">
|
|
http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/HTTP_implementation</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<h3 id="item03">3. Define Types of Addressing</h3>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> zakim: mute me</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Types_of_Fragment_Addressing">
|
|
http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Types_of_Fragment_Addressing</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Erik:</cite> page prepared by Davy (with
|
|
Guillaume input?)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Davy:</cite> this page has origin from
|
|
the list of issues we have discussed during our 1st face to
|
|
face meeting<br />
|
|
... Track: whether a media format supports tracks or not
|
|
depends on the Container format, but not the Coding format</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Frank:</cite> do you consider all the
|
|
video quality level in one track? for example in a media
|
|
adaptation use case</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Davy:</cite> I do not think that a
|
|
different quality of the video is a fragment</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> discussion about what is
|
|
the boudaries of the track definition</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> examples such as multiple
|
|
camera angles, multiple resolution of the same video in the
|
|
same stream, audio languages, subtitles: are all of these
|
|
tracks ?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> the boundary should be
|
|
what the encapsulation format exposes<br />
|
|
... or rather the container format</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> if the container format
|
|
exposes the notion of tracks, we could address them, otherwise,
|
|
we should NOT invent them<br />
|
|
... we look at the table</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> different camera angles
|
|
can be seen as multiple video tracks<br />
|
|
... different resolution: encoding format does not work that
|
|
way, they tend to provide different files<br />
|
|
... we should not worry about that now, can be dealt with
|
|
later</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Davy:</cite> Temporal dimension: need to
|
|
take into account the precision we can get in the time
|
|
point<br />
|
|
... Spatial dimension: we cannot generally extract a region,
|
|
not make yet a decision if we consider only rectangle regions
|
|
or arbitrary shapes<br />
|
|
... Name dimension: again depends on the container format! For
|
|
example, one can include a CMML or TimedText description in a
|
|
MP4 or Ogg container</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> QuickTime has
|
|
'QuickTimeText' that can be used to jump to a dvd chapter</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> cueranges</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> Flash has cueranges</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://www.apple.com/quicktime/tutorials/texttracks.html">http://www.apple.com/quicktime/tutorials/texttracks.html</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> ups,
|
|
s/cueranges/cuepoints/</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> <a href=
|
|
"http://help.adobe.com/en_US/Soundbooth/2.0/WSA5A1DDFB-6BE2-4486-BE0C-A10CEEF119ADa.html">
|
|
http://help.adobe.com/en_US/Soundbooth/2.0/WSA5A1DDFB-6BE2-4486-BE0C-A10CEEF119ADa.html</a>
|
|
?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Davy:</cite> the table is not complete
|
|
yet, for some format, I couldn't figure out what is possible or
|
|
not<br />
|
|
... summary is that generally, the temporal dimension is not a
|
|
problem<br />
|
|
... for the spatial dimension, this is more problematic!<br />
|
|
... a ROI can be extracted with H264, but this is not a crop,
|
|
rather a decrease in quality<br />
|
|
... but generally not possible to extract a region in the
|
|
compressed domain</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> it is not clear what to
|
|
do with a spatial fragment<br />
|
|
... my suggestion would be that the server send the whole
|
|
picture, but the UA does something with the fragment, e.g.
|
|
highlight the region</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Davy:</cite> for a mobile use case, it
|
|
makes more sense to not download the whole image, but just the
|
|
region</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Frank:</cite> why not specifying that in
|
|
the URI, whether the client want to download the complete
|
|
resource or not</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> can be done in HTTP with an
|
|
extension<br />
|
|
... the discovery phase will be: server, tell me what do you
|
|
support<br />
|
|
... for example, using the option method, or some parameters in
|
|
the GET, there are many options<br />
|
|
... we can then implement the OPTIONS response, or a content
|
|
negociation<br />
|
|
... discovery is always painful!</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> we always found that
|
|
discovery was difficult<br />
|
|
... we had to find out which tracks were available</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://wiki.xiph.org/index.php/ROE">http://wiki.xiph.org/index.php/ROE</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> we discussed a format,
|
|
named ROE, which is a media file format description<br />
|
|
... this is currently used in Metavid<br />
|
|
... I'm not sure how the discovery and selection should be
|
|
handled by URI or not<br />
|
|
... the UA asks for the ROE file, parse the XML and knows which
|
|
tracks are available, the UA can then request the right
|
|
track</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> e.g.
|
|
?track=a1,v1,sub1,cap1</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> can we find the track
|
|
description in some headers of the container format?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Davy:</cite> it depends on the format,
|
|
it might be the case</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> I agree, it didn't exist
|
|
for ogg, that's why we invented ROE<br />
|
|
... I'm in favor of specifying a syntax, even though just one
|
|
format will be able to deal with it<br />
|
|
... so have a way of specifying tracks and we may list later on
|
|
which codec and container formats can process</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Davy:</cite> the audio encoding formats
|
|
are just relevant for the temporal dimension<br />
|
|
... the still images format: JPEG2000 is pretty advanced<br />
|
|
... the container formats: mov, mp4, 3gp allows to select track
|
|
and names, but we need to modify some values (for example
|
|
change the length field)<br />
|
|
... for other formats such as MXG, ASF, I put question
|
|
marks</p><a name="action08" id="action08"></a>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>scribe</cite>>
|
|
<strong>ACTION:</strong> Davy to complete the table, trying to
|
|
get the answer for the current question marks, except when this
|
|
is a close format [recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action08">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action08</a>]</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Created ACTION-22
|
|
- Complete the table, trying to get the answer for the current
|
|
question marks, except when this is a close format [on Davy Van
|
|
Deursen - due 2008-12-16].</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Davy:</cite> some formats are then
|
|
useless for our purpose, because they will support nothing
|
|
(e.g. WAV, AIFF, AU, XMF)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> it is still interested
|
|
to report this information in the document<br />
|
|
... Summary: we agree to cover these 4 dimensions<br />
|
|
... perhaps the syntax will be simpler for the temporal
|
|
dimension, since it will be 99% of our use cases<br />
|
|
... perhaps the temporal dimension will be the default
|
|
one<br />
|
|
... up to decide to the WG when we will talk about the
|
|
syntax</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>LUNCH TIME</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>Silvia, quick poll</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> yes?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>Media Annotations is willing to organize the
|
|
next joint face to face meeting in Barcelona</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>prior to the WWW conference in Madrid</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> awww - I'd love to
|
|
go there!</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>potential dates are: 16 and 17 of April</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>WWW conference will then be 20-24 of April</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>so you have to spend the week-end in Barcelona
|
|
and/or Madrid</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>scribe:</cite> we can also go to the
|
|
beach :-)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>will you be able to make it ?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> maybe</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> will need to see
|
|
from the biz POV and whether I can get Mozilla to sponsor
|
|
it</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>depends on your funding ? Mozilla?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> (or some of it)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>ok</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>good, but I note your interest</p>
|
|
|
|
<h3 id="item04">4. Implementation Issues (protocol &
|
|
caching)</h3>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> when you're in
|
|
australia, meeting people in your field is of major interest,
|
|
since everybody is so far away</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>Yves leads the dicussion</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> look at <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/HTTP_Fragment_Caches">
|
|
http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/HTTP_Fragment_Caches</a><br />
|
|
|
|
... there is a discussion in the mailing list between myself,
|
|
Silvia and others<br />
|
|
... about the solutions recommended by annodex, the 4-way
|
|
handshakes<br />
|
|
... and I was discussing the alternative 2-way handshakes<br />
|
|
... both are limited, because it will be difficult to access
|
|
track fragments, and even worst spatial fragments, because
|
|
transcoding might be required</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> we should not use
|
|
fragment when a transcoding operation is needed</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> when you deal with tracks,
|
|
do you think we can handle everything in the compressed
|
|
domains?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> yes, tracks are dealt
|
|
with by the container formats</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Davy:</cite> yes it depends on the
|
|
format<br />
|
|
... why do you think the outcome of a transcoding operation is
|
|
not a fragment anymore ?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> because there is no one
|
|
to one mapping between the bytes of the original file and the
|
|
outcome file<br />
|
|
... i'm talking about physical fragment and not logical
|
|
fragment</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> I argue that a fragment in
|
|
the URI spec does not specify if it is a compressed
|
|
resource<br />
|
|
... it is a part of the resource</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> I argue that a fragment
|
|
of a original resource must be a part of the resource</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> I do not argue<br />
|
|
... you can have lostless transformation process, but there is
|
|
not a single byte range process</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> I didn't argue about
|
|
having a single or multiple byte ranges</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>Yves and Davy disagree</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> if you transcode to a
|
|
different format, yes, this is a different resource<br />
|
|
... but if you transcode to the same format, I would consider
|
|
this is the same resource<br />
|
|
... so a valid fragment<br />
|
|
... example, get all <H1> in a HTML page, this is a
|
|
fragment<br />
|
|
... it might not be a continous fragment, so difficult to
|
|
cache, but it is still a fragment</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> YES, but you're not
|
|
changing the bytes, you have the same bytes</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> ok, but if you use FLAC,
|
|
which is lostless, you will have a valid fragment<br />
|
|
... mp3 is definitively not the same thing<br />
|
|
... the fact that the stored bytes are different is not
|
|
relevant<br />
|
|
... the criteria is what you get, what you watch</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> ok, but how cache will
|
|
handle that?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> caches are not forced to
|
|
store _all_ fragments, need to be specified<br />
|
|
... merging does not involve a simple concatenation of bytes
|
|
... you already add information for serving the fragments</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> I think we will have a
|
|
lot of pitfalls with this path</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> which ones ? I want to see
|
|
examples</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> take samples of a FLAC
|
|
file, decode them, and re-encode them, you will not get a
|
|
playable piece ???<br />
|
|
... I just do not see happening this extra complexity</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> perhaps, but nothing
|
|
prevent to do that?<br />
|
|
... i'm arguing that such operation done in the cache might be
|
|
more efficient</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> i don't want to support
|
|
transoding with loss of information</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> agree, fair thing to
|
|
do<br />
|
|
... but not all merging operation have to be done with
|
|
transcoding</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> which formats are we
|
|
talking about ?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Davy:</cite> most of them that are used
|
|
loose information anyway</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> if you do a lossy
|
|
transformation, then you will get another resource, so another
|
|
URI<br />
|
|
... but it can be done transparently using content
|
|
negotiation<br />
|
|
... another issue, is that annodex create an unlimited numbers
|
|
of sub-resources<br />
|
|
... because it uses the ? and not a real fragment</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> we did that because we
|
|
thought it was not appropriate to use the '#' ... but I'm happy
|
|
to use now the hash</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> i just want to come to the
|
|
header (and footer) of the current annodex solution ... that is
|
|
done in the compressed domain<br />
|
|
... the solution I'm talking about has headers modified<br />
|
|
... smart caches will have a way of doing merge in the
|
|
compressed domain<br />
|
|
... it can be done in specialized proxies (dedicated to
|
|
media)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> in Ogg, it is not
|
|
possible to have a video file with a gap at the beginning and a
|
|
gap and a gap in the middle</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> it will not result
|
|
in a valid resource</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> thus, if you have
|
|
more than one segment, it needs to be done as video
|
|
playlists</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> the solution we advocated
|
|
in Annodex will not store n times the overlap</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> in my solution, we will
|
|
store just the complete playable files<br />
|
|
... so we are talking about the same thing, except that in my
|
|
case, we store additional headers and footers</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>Hi Conrad ...</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>conrad</cite>> hi raphael :-)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Conclusion:</cite> Yves advocates to
|
|
store and cache what the server is serving, playable resources,
|
|
so the bytes corresponding to the fragment requested enhanced
|
|
with the appropriate header/footer depending on the encoding
|
|
format</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> same as byte ranges, if
|
|
there is overlap, the cache will merge them<br />
|
|
... we are talking about smart caches ... the other ones will
|
|
not cache them</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> I will favor we go mainly
|
|
for byte ranges and see immediate implementations<br />
|
|
... and see later what can be improved</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> if you want to do only byte
|
|
ranges, you should do it such a way that it is still a
|
|
fragment<br />
|
|
... the solution I was advocating does that naturally, but
|
|
requires smart caches</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> The byte range based
|
|
proposal for caching web proxies in annodex is one that can be
|
|
supported by existing web proxies</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> therefore I suggest
|
|
we support that first</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> the difference
|
|
between this and what Yves proposes is that the recomposition
|
|
intelligence goes into the server or into the web proxy</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> but does annodex
|
|
solution implies storing additional information such as
|
|
header/footer ?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> if Yves case, the
|
|
web proxy has to know about all the encoding formats and needs
|
|
to understand how to recompose them</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Erik:</cite> I wonder if your two
|
|
solutions are orthogonal or not?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> I was proposing to
|
|
allow both</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> Silvia, YES, but Yves
|
|
talked about smart dedicated web media proxies</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>Yves:</cite> I agree with supporting
|
|
both, but I would add we put too much emphasis on caching,
|
|
given that most of the traffic is not cached anyway<br />
|
|
... so we should not spend too much time on caches</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> it's done through
|
|
services like Akamai</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Yves</cite>> who are not using HTTP
|
|
caches for that (at least the CDN I know of)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> no, they are using
|
|
proprietary solutions</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> and thus avoiding
|
|
the existing Web proxy infrastructure</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> but that's outside
|
|
of what we need to worry about :)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Yves</cite>> yes :)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> say hi to the media
|
|
annotations guys :)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Silvia</cite>> I will continue to
|
|
hang out here</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>Coffee break</p>
|
|
|
|
<h3 id="item05">5. Joint Session with Media Annotations WG</h3>
|
|
|
|
<h3 id="item06">joint meeting MF & MA</h3>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>erik</cite>> poll third F2F:
|
|
16/04-17/04 @ Barcelona (prior to WWW conference @ Madrid)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>erik</cite>> everybody finds it a
|
|
good idea</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>erik</cite>> Raphael to talk about
|
|
status of MF group</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>erik</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Main_Page">http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Main_Page</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>erik</cite>> Raphael summarizes
|
|
wiki-pages under "Preparation of Working Draft"</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>erik</cite>> * Use Cases</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>erik</cite>> ... <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Use_Cases_%26_Requirements_Draft">
|
|
http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Use_Cases_%26_Requirements_Draft</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>erik</cite>> ... functional and
|
|
non-functional requirements are also part of that UC page</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>erik</cite>> * Communication
|
|
between client and server</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>erik</cite>> ... <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/HTTP_implementation">
|
|
http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/HTTP_implementation</a>
|
|
(to be elaborated soon)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>erik</cite>> ... 2-way & 4-way
|
|
handshake</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>erik</cite>> * Existing
|
|
technologies</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>erik</cite>> ... <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Existing_Technologies_Survey">
|
|
http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Existing_Technologies_Survey</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>erik</cite>> ... cover all
|
|
technologies out there & in the end convert our solution
|
|
back to existing ones</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>erik</cite>> Question: what type of
|
|
fragments will be possible?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>erik</cite>> ... temporal for sure
|
|
in v1</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>erik</cite>> ... temporal &
|
|
spatial for video is most difficult one in v2</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>erik</cite>> ... also tracks are in
|
|
scope in v1</p><a name="action09" id="action09"></a>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>erik</cite>>
|
|
<strong>ACTION:</strong> Erik (together with Jean-Pierre) to
|
|
add TV-Anytime also to Existing Technologies Survey [recorded
|
|
in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action09">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action09</a>]</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Created ACTION-23
|
|
- (together with Jean-Pierre) to add TV-Anytime also to
|
|
Existing Technologies Survey [on Erik Mannens - due
|
|
2008-12-16].</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>erik</cite>> ability of using XMP
|
|
for notition of tracks ... this seems possible (link MF &
|
|
MA) ... to be investigated</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>scribe</cite>> scribenick: erik</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>UNKNOWN_SPEAKER:</cite> common scenario
|
|
from MA (description of resources) to MF (communication
|
|
client/server through content negotiation) for selecting
|
|
tracks</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>fsasaki</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/wiki/XMP">http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/wiki/XMP</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>fsasaki</cite>>
|
|
Ingredients</p><a name="action10" id="action10"></a>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>scribe</cite>>
|
|
<strong>ACTION:</strong> Erik (through extra info from Felix)
|
|
to ask Adobe (Larry) more info about xmpMM:Ingredients
|
|
[recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action10">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action10</a>]</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Created ACTION-24
|
|
- (through extra info from Felix) to ask Adobe (Larry) more
|
|
info about xmpMM:Ingredients [on Erik Mannens - due
|
|
2008-12-16].</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>Felix to talk about status of MA group</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>* stating problem of information loss when
|
|
mapping (setting) information from one format to generic MA
|
|
ontology</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>scribe:</cite> Raphael: is common subset
|
|
on metalevel not enough?<br />
|
|
... felix: looked at existing meta-models today ... all
|
|
"getting" models, not "setting" ... issues (protocol,
|
|
information loss)<br />
|
|
... Raphael: maybe MF can give some input via explanation of
|
|
our table ... within ...<br />
|
|
... <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Types_of_Fragment_Addressing">
|
|
http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Types_of_Fragment_Addressing</a><br />
|
|
|
|
... summary: 5th column ... everywhere where there is a
|
|
"1"&"2" it is possible to add metadata within</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>raphael</cite>> Raphael: in case
|
|
some metadata are embedded into the header of a media resource,
|
|
should we be able to have access to it using a fragment ?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>raphael</cite>> ... using which
|
|
dimension ? the 'name' dimension ?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>felix:</cite> will named fragments be
|
|
possible?<br />
|
|
... Raphael: yes (i18 will be problem to handle though)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>* XMP overview</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>scribe:</cite> <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/wiki/XMP">http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/wiki/XMP</a><br />
|
|
|
|
... Raphael: what about collisions of types/values?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Daniel</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://dev.w3.org/2008/video/mediaann/mediaont-api-1.0/mediaont-api-1.0.html">
|
|
http://dev.w3.org/2008/video/mediaann/mediaont-api-1.0/mediaont-api-1.0.html</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>scribe:</cite> only get-functions for
|
|
the moment (cfr. "setting"-problem)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>fsasaki</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/wiki/FeaturesTable">
|
|
http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/wiki/FeaturesTable</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>fsasaki</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://dev.w3.org/2008/video/mediaann/mediaont-req/mediaont-req.html">
|
|
http://dev.w3.org/2008/video/mediaann/mediaont-req/mediaont-req.html</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>scribe:</cite> UC document</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>formal review of MA UC Doc by MF (probably
|
|
before 31/12/08)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>formal review of MF UC Doc by MA (and others
|
|
SVG, HTML5, TimedText) (probably before 31/01/09)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>raphael</cite>> adjourn</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>raphael</cite>> thx the
|
|
organizers</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>vmalais</cite>> logout</p>
|
|
</div>
|
|
|
|
<h2><a name="ActionSummary" id="ActionSummary">Summary of Action
|
|
Items</a></h2><!-- Action Items -->
|
|
<strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> Davy to complete
|
|
the table, trying to get the answer for the current question
|
|
marks, except when this is a close format [recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action08">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action08</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> Erik (through
|
|
extra info from Felix) to ask Adobe (Larry) more info about
|
|
xmpMM:Ingredients [recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action10">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action10</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> Erik (together
|
|
with Jean-Pierre) to add TV-Anytime also to Existing Technologies
|
|
Survey [recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action09">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action09</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> Erik to check
|
|
with Philippe the status of Cisco (Paul Bosso), Apple (Dave
|
|
Singer or Eric Carlson) [recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action05">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action05</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> Michael to check
|
|
with Wolfgang whether he is still interested in this WG [recorded
|
|
in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action04">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action04</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> Raphael to check
|
|
with Karen the status of Fox Interactive, if they could have an
|
|
interest in the group [recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action06">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action06</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> Raphael to see
|
|
with Marie Claire who from Daily Motion can join [recorded in
|
|
<a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action02">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action02</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> Rapha�l to check
|
|
with Karen the status of Fox Interactive, if they could have an
|
|
interest in the group [recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action07">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action07</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> Troncy to check
|
|
with Karen about Blinx joining or not W3C and Colm the WG
|
|
[recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action03">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action03</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> Yves to find out
|
|
with Philippe who from Google would be interested to join
|
|
[recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action01">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html#action01</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<br />
|
|
[End of minutes]<br />
|
|
<hr />
|
|
|
|
<address>
|
|
Minutes formatted by David Booth's <a href=
|
|
"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm">
|
|
scribe.perl</a> version 1.133 (<a href=
|
|
"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/">CVS log</a>)<br />
|
|
$Date: 2008/12/09 16:02:42 $
|
|
</address>
|
|
|
|
<div class="diagnostics">
|
|
<hr />
|
|
|
|
<h2>Scribe.perl diagnostic output</h2>[Delete this section
|
|
before finalizing the minutes.]<br />
|
|
<pre>
|
|
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.133 of Date: 2008/01/18 18:48:51
|
|
Check for newer version at <a href=
|
|
"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/">http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/</a>
|
|
|
|
Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)
|
|
|
|
Succeeded: s/N/?/
|
|
Succeeded: s/encoding/encapsulation/
|
|
Succeeded: s/option/OPTIONS/
|
|
Succeeded: s/will/may/
|
|
Succeeded: s/Sivlia/Silvia/
|
|
Succeeded: s/3. Implementation Issues/4. Implementation Issues/
|
|
Succeeded: s/cache/how cache/
|
|
Succeeded: s/lost/loss/
|
|
Succeeded: s/domains/domain/
|
|
Succeeded: s/anhanced/enhanced/
|
|
Succeeded: s/apropriate/sppropriate/
|
|
Succeeded: s/sppropriate/appropriate/
|
|
Succeeded: s/was/I was/
|
|
Succeeded: s/do/allow/
|
|
Found ScribeNick: raphael
|
|
Found ScribeNick: erik
|
|
Inferring Scribes: raphael, erik
|
|
Scribes: raphael, erik
|
|
ScribeNicks: raphael, erik
|
|
|
|
WARNING: Replacing list of attendees.
|
|
Old list: +0329331aaaa Tom Raphael Erik Davy Frank Yves +61.2.801.2.aabb Silvia
|
|
New list: +329331aaaa Meeting_Room +61.2.801.2.aabb Silvia
|
|
|
|
Default Present: +329331aaaa, Meeting_Room, +61.2.801.2.aabb, Silvia
|
|
|
|
WARNING: Replacing previous Present list. (Old list: Yves, Erik, Raphael, Tom, Davy, Frank_(canon_observer), Silvia, (irc))
|
|
Use 'Present+ ... ' if you meant to add people without replacing the list,
|
|
such as: <dbooth> Present+ Yves, Frank, Davy, Erik, Raphael, Tom, Silvia_(remote)
|
|
|
|
Present: Yves Frank Davy Erik Raphael Tom Silvia_(remote)
|
|
Agenda: <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/SecondF2FAgenda">http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/SecondF2FAgenda</a>
|
|
Found Date: 09 Dec 2008
|
|
Guessing minutes URL: <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html">http://www.w3.org/2008/12/09-mediafrag-minutes.html</a>
|
|
People with action items: davy erik extra felix from info jean-pierre l michael rapha raphael through together troncy with yves
|
|
|
|
</pre>[End of <a href=
|
|
"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm">
|
|
scribe.perl</a> diagnostic output]
|
|
</div>
|
|
</body>
|
|
</html>
|