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1479 lines
55 KiB
1479 lines
55 KiB
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<meta name="generator" content=
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<title>Social Web Incubator Group Teleconference -- 02 Dec
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2009</title>
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<p><a href="http://www.w3.org/"><img src=
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"48" width="72" /></a></p>
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<h1>- DRAFT -</h1>
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<h1>Social Web Incubator Group Teleconference</h1>
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<h2>02 Dec 2009</h2>
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<p>See also: <a href="http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-irc">IRC
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log</a></p>
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<h2><a name="attendees" id="attendees">Attendees</a></h2>
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<div class="intro">
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<dl>
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<dt>Present</dt>
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<dd>+39.011.228.aaaa, +049172247aabb, hhalpin,
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+1.774.811.aacc, +1.781.273.aadd, claudio, MacTed,
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+7.970.94.aaff, rreck, AlexPassant, tpa</dd>
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<dt>Regrets</dt>
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<dt>Chair</dt>
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<dd>hhalpin</dd>
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<dt>Scribe</dt>
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<dd>AlexPassant</dd>
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</dl>
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</div>
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<h2>Contents</h2>
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<ul>
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<li>
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<a href="#agenda">Topics</a>
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<ol>
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<li><a href="#item01">Convene SWXG WG meeting of
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2009-12-02T16:00-17:00GMT</a></li>
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<li><a href="#item02">User Stories</a></li>
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<li><a href="#item03">For Final Report</a></li>
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<li><a href="#item04">Invited Guest Invitations</a></li>
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<li><a href="#item05">Chris Messina on
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ActivityStreams</a></li>
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</ol>
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</li>
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<li><a href="#ActionSummary">Summary of Action Items</a></li>
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</ul>
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<hr />
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<div class="meeting">
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<p class='phone'> </p>
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<p class='phone'> </p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Date: 02 December
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2009</p>
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<p class='phone'>zakim where are u :-) ?</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>yoshiaki</cite>> 7994 might be
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mine, yoshiaki</p>
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<h3 id="item01">Convene SWXG WG meeting of
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2009-12-02T16:00-17:00GMT</h3>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> not that i want to,
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but i cant scribe</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>MacTed</cite>> I could easily be
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the worst scribe ever</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> i thought its me</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> pchampin: it might be
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you</p>
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<p class='phone'>ok i will</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> scribe:
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AlexPassant</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> scribenick:
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AlexPassant</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> PROPOSED: to
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approve SWXG WG Weekly -- 25th November 2009 as a true
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record</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2009/11/25-swxg-minutes.html">http://www.w3.org/2009/11/25-swxg-minutes.html</a></p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> minutes of last week</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> pchampin: yeah its
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you</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> RESOLVED: approved
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SWXG WG Weekly -- 25th November 2009 as a true record</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> no objections</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> PROPOSED: to meet
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again Wed. Decemeber 9th</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> next week</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> FOAF and FOAF+SSL
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and RDF for data integration over social nets...</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> DanBri, can you
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make next week/</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> FOAF and FOAF+SSL and
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RDF for data integration on the Social Web</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Henry Story?</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> just a sec</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> will talk about FOAF
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Updating coordination<br />
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... ideally with portable contacts</p>
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<h3 id="item02">User Stories</h3>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>Adam</cite>> +1 Alex</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Tim?</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> user stories</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> Progress on user stories</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>tpa</cite>> <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/RequirementsAndUseCases-WorkArea">
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http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/RequirementsAndUseCases-WorkArea</a></p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> very nice!</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> changed the order of
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stories<br />
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... structure of the document</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> which user am
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I?</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> business model angle<br />
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... corporate contect (e.g. soc net in large compagny)<br />
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... featureS: linking people annotating, consuming<br />
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... structured in 10 parts, from an end-user perspective<br />
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... try to get a comprehensive view of the field</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> +1 on presence
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management</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>MacTed</cite>> *great* UseCases
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revision.</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> lots of changes in a
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week</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> *Very* good
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work.</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>cperey</cite>> zakim
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+1.617.848.aajj is me</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> help needed on some user
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stories<br />
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... to get them filled<br />
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... better direction for the document</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> ack ??P26</p>
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<p class='phone'>no</p>
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<p class='phone'>I just handed up for zakim</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>cperey</cite>> +q</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/weekly-agenda.html">
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http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/weekly-agenda.html</a></p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Are these no longer
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relevant?</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Happy to kill
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them...</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> what about actions on
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the weekly agenda<br />
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... are they still required ?</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Do you want me to
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tell me which ones are still relevant?</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> some of them might be still
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needed, some not<br />
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... have to go through</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>cperey</cite>> you can close my
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action on business narrative from last week</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> can drop the older
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ones</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> corporate story still valid
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(adam)</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>Adam</cite>> i am</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> business - done</p><a name=
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"action01" id="action01"></a>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>>
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<strong>ACTION:</strong> <strong>[DONE]</strong> cperey to take
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business narrative [recorded in <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action01">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action01</a>]</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Sorry, couldn't
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find user - <strong>[DONE]</strong></p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> re API/widget
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discussion, I met with Robin Berjon briefly last week, he's
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keen to come talk w/ us re DAP WG and related</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> ACTION
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<strong>[DONE]</strong>: cperey to take business narrative</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Sorry, couldn't
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find user - <strong>[DONE]</strong></p><a name="action02" id=
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"action02"></a>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>>
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<strong>ACTION:</strong> <strong>[DONE]</strong> cperey to take
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business narrative [recorded in <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action02">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action02</a>]</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> let people listed on the old
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ones to decide themselves</p><a name="action03" id=
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"action03"></a>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>>
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<strong>ACTION:</strong> <strong>[CONTINUES]</strong> adam to
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take on corporate story [recorded in <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action03">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action03</a>]</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> pchampin: thanks</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> some are still usable and
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needed</p><a name="action04" id="action04"></a>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>>
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<strong>ACTION:</strong> <strong>[DONE]</strong> (2 weeks) adam
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to write up the boeing use case for enterprise social networks
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[recorded in <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action04">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action04</a>]</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> use cases moved to section 4
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(third party)<br />
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... including APIs<br />
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... mostly tries to do a mapping</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>cperey</cite>> +q</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> some ended up in multiple
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categories</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>cperey:</cite> fill-in description for
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each of them<br />
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... went through the all section, feedback required</p><a name=
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"action05" id="action05"></a>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>>
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<strong>ACTION:</strong> <strong>[CONTINUES]</strong> rreck to
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flesh out anonymous usecase connecting to multiple identies and
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null provenance (rreck) [recorded in <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action05">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action05</a>]</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>cperey:</cite> is that a sufficient
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level of detail at this time ?<br />
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... or is that too much ?<br />
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... needs review on the first section</p><a name="action06" id=
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"action06"></a>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>>
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<strong>ACTION:</strong> <strong>[CONTINUES]</strong> oshani to
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reframe the geolocation/intent/portability (2 weeks) [recorded
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in <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action06">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action06</a>]</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>cperey:</cite> as it will drive the rest
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of the work<br />
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... sectino on business models</p><a name="action07" id=
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"action07"></a>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>>
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<strong>ACTION:</strong> <strong>[CONTINUES]</strong> bblfish
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to relabel data protection use case to be about controlled
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access and takedown to data "about" you (2 weeks) [recorded in
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<a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action07">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action07</a>]</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>cperey:</cite> is this the right place
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for this content ?<br />
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... not sure that it needs to be there<br />
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... out of scope ?</p><a name="action08" id="action08"></a>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>>
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<strong>ACTION:</strong> <strong>[CONTINUES]</strong> bblfish
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to merge Family and Group access usecases (2 weeks) [recorded
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in <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action08">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action08</a>]</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>cperey:</cite> economic / revenue
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belongs to this document ?<br />
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... business models seems odd where it is at the
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moment</p><a name="action09" id="action09"></a>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>>
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<strong>ACTION:</strong> (2 weeks) hhalpin explain to henry and
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oshani doc editing process for usecases (2 weeks) [recorded in
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<a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action09">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action09</a>]</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Sorry, couldn't
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find user - (2</p><a name="action10" id="action10"></a>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>>
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<strong>ACTION:</strong> <strong>[CONTINUES]</strong> (2 weeks)
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hhalpin explain to henry and oshani doc editing process for
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usecases (2 weeks) [recorded in <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action10">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action10</a>]</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> template at the top of the
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catalogue<br />
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... need description of corporate context and developer
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views<br />
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... tags to each story would make sense<br />
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... but bery good description</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>cperey:</cite> tpa can you do tags<br />
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... to avoid heterogeneity</p><a name="action11" id=
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"action11"></a>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>tpa</cite>>
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<strong>ACTION:</strong> tanglade to tag existing stories
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[recorded in <a href=
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"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action11">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action11</a>]</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Created ACTION-114
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- Tag existing stories [on Tim Anglade - due 2009-12-09].</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>cperey:</cite> better consistency if
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only one / 2 people to the tags<br />
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... be consistent with the tags</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> original doc was called
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reuirements and use-cases<br />
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... business part is more about requirements<br />
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... nice illustration of the user stories<br />
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... included some way in the final report<br />
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... as it matters , on a bigger extent<br />
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... site X uses this block and that one<br />
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... get a complete catalogue</p>
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<h3 id="item03">For Final Report</h3>
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<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> nice illustration</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> buiness X wants to
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Y<br />
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... what are the requirements<br />
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... necessary for business but not for users<br />
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... more an argumentative / narrative</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> you are dropping out
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hhalpin</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> i can</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> maybe it was just
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me</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> This definitely
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needs some manpower, but keeping it short and sweet is
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great.</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> some are very
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straightforward stories</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> ?</p>
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<p class='irc'><<cite>Adam</cite>> yeah, i will have more
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time coming up</p>
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<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> will work on it</p>
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|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>melvster</cite>> ill put some time
|
|
in ...</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> like to get most of the
|
|
stories filled by next week<br />
|
|
... then can concentrate on the narrative, tagging</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> I'll give it a good
|
|
review over Christmas...#</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> needs one or 2 people</p>
|
|
|
|
<h3 id="item04">Invited Guest Invitations</h3>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> hi</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> invited guest agenda</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>danbri:</cite> updted on the
|
|
widgets</p><a name="action12" id="action12"></a>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>>
|
|
<strong>ACTION:</strong> <strong>[CONTINUES]</strong> danbri to
|
|
find someone from Opera to talk Widgets (2 weeks) [recorded in
|
|
<a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action12">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action12</a>]</p><a name="action13"
|
|
id="action13"></a>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>>
|
|
<strong>ACTION:</strong> <strong>[CONTINUES]</strong> hhalpin
|
|
to try to get TimBL to either talk or write-up his use-cases
|
|
[recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action13">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action13</a>]</p>
|
|
|
|
<h3 id="item05">Chris Messina on ActivityStreams</h3>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> invited speaker</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>chrismessina</cite>> morning
|
|
all</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> Chris Messina on
|
|
Activity Streams</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>mischat</cite>> I will be able to
|
|
time and effort into this tpa hhalpin</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> action danbri set up
|
|
a *oodle thing to pick a date for widget/apis telecon</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Created ACTION-115
|
|
- Set up a *oodle thing to pick a date for widget/apis telecon
|
|
[on Dan Brickley - due 2009-12-09].</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> forwarded links about a
|
|
week ago<br />
|
|
... let Chris introduce himself<br />
|
|
... DISO, etc</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://activitystrea.ms/">http://activitystrea.ms/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://diso-project.org/">http://diso-project.org/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> interest in social
|
|
web, communities<br />
|
|
... for the last 5 yeasrs</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://factoryjoe.com/blog/2008/12/20/where-were-going-with-activity-streams/">
|
|
http://factoryjoe.com/blog/2008/12/20/where-were-going-with-activity-streams/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> worked on firefox
|
|
marketing</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://factoryjoe.com/blog">http://factoryjoe.com/blog</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> introduction to the
|
|
power of social web / open source<br />
|
|
... what a community was like<br />
|
|
... started on Flock<br />
|
|
... open source architect</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Links to most the
|
|
projects are here:</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://factoryjoe.com/blog/projects/">http://factoryjoe.com/blog/projects/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> fundamental vision:
|
|
browsers are for a web of documents, not for a web of
|
|
people<br />
|
|
... make easier to enable interactions<br />
|
|
... link all the social networks that one's part of<br />
|
|
... time before google acq. youtube, etc.<br />
|
|
... browser as the natural place to list people and friends</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> a browser for
|
|
myspace :)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> left when the
|
|
browser idea changed<br />
|
|
... microformats community<br />
|
|
... let browsers support microformats<br />
|
|
... involved in the openid community</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> +1 flocks very
|
|
useful when we in W3C were looking at microformats and RDF with
|
|
GRDDL...</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> get oauth off the
|
|
ground<br />
|
|
... openid board member<br />
|
|
... 2 years term<br />
|
|
... involvement in the activity streams project</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://activitystrea.ms/">http://activitystrea.ms/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> DISO project<br />
|
|
... ... opensocial was not open nor social<br />
|
|
... needded for open social network<br />
|
|
... DISO came a framework for such Open SocNet<br />
|
|
... will hopefully provide interoperrability building blocks
|
|
for the social web</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> ActivityStream
|
|
Generator for Opera: <a href=
|
|
"http://dev.opera.com/libraries/activitystream/">http://dev.opera.com/libraries/activitystream/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> activitystreams
|
|
started when seeing all streams, feeds, etc. on the web<br />
|
|
... RSS and Atom as the data input to build the streams<br />
|
|
... rich stream / how to understand it<br />
|
|
... need more experssive formats than RSS / Atom<br />
|
|
... researched what kind of activities / verbs were used<br />
|
|
... extension to the Atom format<br />
|
|
... transfor AtomXML to a JSON representation to be used in
|
|
opensocial<br />
|
|
... next opensocial version - much richers</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> -> eg <a href=
|
|
"http://groups.google.com/group/activity-streams/browse_thread/thread/16c570492e74afa5">
|
|
http://groups.google.com/group/activity-streams/browse_thread/thread/16c570492e74afa5</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> aggregating,
|
|
filtering, merging, ...<br />
|
|
... activities from several sources<br />
|
|
... move opensocial activity streams<br />
|
|
... verb URIs, JSON representation<br />
|
|
... compatibility between different initiatives<br />
|
|
... myspace is using it</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Zakim</cite>> danbri, you wanted to
|
|
ask re atom/json design</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>chrismessina</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://feedproxy.cliqset.com/">http://feedproxy.cliqset.com/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>danbri:</cite> issues coming up to have
|
|
a JSON design<br />
|
|
... noticed similar things on portablecontacts<br />
|
|
... merging practices ?<br />
|
|
... particular JSON / XML expressions</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> not a dev. but
|
|
understands (UI and design background)<br />
|
|
... yet, biggest issue is to get the XML schema to JSON</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> yes!</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> JSON issues with
|
|
namespaces...</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> does not deal with
|
|
namespaces properly</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> This is a very
|
|
interesting blog post:</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://factoryjoe.com/blog/2009/11/16/the-death-of-the-url/">http://factoryjoe.com/blog/2009/11/16/the-death-of-the-url/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Death of the
|
|
URL</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> specifying
|
|
expressive JSON activity stream API in opensocial<br />
|
|
... not worrying to much on extensions</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> that's the main
|
|
problem with JSON: <a href=
|
|
"http://blogs.sun.com/bblfish/entry/the_limitations_of_json">http://blogs.sun.com/bblfish/entry/the_limitations_of_json</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> issues also heard
|
|
from the PortableContact people<br />
|
|
... some efforts needed<br />
|
|
... 2 important things</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> what is needed is a
|
|
JSON rdf format</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> in RDF scene,
|
|
there's still (hopefully) work done mapping RDF over to JSON is
|
|
some standardized way...</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> straughtforward way
|
|
of expressing the activity mode<br />
|
|
... + schema for expressing these things<br />
|
|
... use the same URI to identify the different verbs</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> verb
|
|
proliferation....</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> sounds like you could
|
|
use a verb taxonomy</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Sounds like the
|
|
owl:sameAs problem...</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><a href=
|
|
"http://milanstankovic.org/opo-actions/specs/2009/OPO-Actions-20090501/">
|
|
http://milanstankovic.org/opo-actions/specs/2009/OPO-Actions-20090501/</a>
|
|
also related to the topic</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> i would look at
|
|
wordnet, and at Levin's verb book</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> I liked <a href=
|
|
"http://groups.google.com/group/activity-streams/msg/3ecd9a340dbc730c">
|
|
http://groups.google.com/group/activity-streams/msg/3ecd9a340dbc730c</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>scribe:</cite> use the same terminology
|
|
(challenge) but gives opportunity</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> "As long as proper
|
|
research and documentation is done, anyone can implement
|
|
whatever verbs they want to; that's why they're URIs! "</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> Levin's verb
|
|
categories are in the public</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> has he heard of
|
|
Levin's verbs?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>rreck:</cite> any reference for that
|
|
?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> yes one second</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> high adoption</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> subject-verb-object
|
|
model</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> and rapid one</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> to me, very similar
|
|
to RDF.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> yet because's
|
|
Atom.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> Levin verb index
|
|
-> <a href=
|
|
"http://www-personal.umich.edu/~jlawler/levin.html">http://www-personal.umich.edu/~jlawler/levin.html</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> make think of RDF
|
|
modeling (in terms of subjct-verb-object</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> they are linked to
|
|
the table of contents which "someone" needs to type in</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> any relationship between
|
|
activity streams and RDF ?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://martin.atkins.me.uk/specs/activitystreams/activityschema">
|
|
http://martin.atkins.me.uk/specs/activitystreams/activityschema</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> activity schema</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>thanks rreck</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> i have typed that TOC
|
|
in</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> schema ->
|
|
<a href="http://martin.atkins.me.uk/specs/activitystreams/activityschema">
|
|
http://martin.atkins.me.uk/specs/activitystreams/activityschema</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>scribe:</cite> how do we keep track when
|
|
adding more verbs</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>chrismessina</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://wiki.activitystrea.ms/Process">http://wiki.activitystrea.ms/Process</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> +q</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> +q</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> bridge efforts
|
|
between different groups</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> I admit I was
|
|
surprised to see the adoption was so rapid, given the data
|
|
model seems very similar to RDF.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> different names to
|
|
describe things</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Which has had
|
|
historical issues with rapid adoption :)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> more likely to go
|
|
and implement their own version</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> on Atom and RDF,
|
|
there is the Atom OWL ontology: <a href=
|
|
"http://bblfish.net/work/atom-owl/2006-06-06/AtomOwl.html">http://bblfish.net/work/atom-owl/2006-06-06/AtomOwl.html</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> looked at the
|
|
patterns<br />
|
|
... extracted best practices</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> so it should be
|
|
easy to add activity streams to the transform</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> turneed into a
|
|
solution that everyone can adopt with minimal effort</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> everyone was
|
|
already using Atom feeds...</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Hmm...looks like a
|
|
GRDDL for ActivityStreams could be in order.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> friendfeed.
|
|
facebook parse the feeds in a very specific way<br />
|
|
... location service sharing<br />
|
|
... goal was to look at what feeds publisher are doing<br />
|
|
... what the actor / object are<br />
|
|
... challenge: what the verb is<br />
|
|
... update the feeds in a non-introsive way<br />
|
|
... 10/15 minutes to get a feed<br />
|
|
... if already publishing atom<br />
|
|
... alignement is as lightweight as possible<br />
|
|
... more pragmatic that data purist<br />
|
|
... anyone that adapt the format is able to showcase the feed
|
|
better than any competitor<br />
|
|
... market place with a desire to solve that problem<br />
|
|
... e.g. myspace wants to get activities from different
|
|
sources<br />
|
|
... plaxo, etc. all duplicating the work<br />
|
|
... opportunity for standardization<br />
|
|
... same as with openid<br />
|
|
... relationship to the RDF triples<br />
|
|
... in general the triple approach is very compelling<br />
|
|
... you can convert in any format once you have the data<br />
|
|
... start with something easy<br />
|
|
... facebook and myspace and youtube onboard<br />
|
|
... look at what can be done with the data in novel ways</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> close fit regarding data
|
|
formats<br />
|
|
... interesting would be to look at activity streams
|
|
mappins</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Ron?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> you cant hear me</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> ok you cant hear
|
|
me</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> darn</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>pchampin</cite>> we can hear
|
|
you</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> (re rdf, some
|
|
colleagues in the notube project did do an rdf mapping, and
|
|
compare/contrast w/ rdf version of activity/event schemas)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>bblfish:</cite> transform Atom into
|
|
RDF<br />
|
|
... worked on the atom syntax spec<br />
|
|
... spend some time to create an ontology for taht<br />
|
|
... one key element that may have slow doen the RDF adoption
|
|
inthat realm<br />
|
|
... apart the tools not being there<br />
|
|
... triples and metadata about the content itself<br />
|
|
... need to distinguish what the content is about<br />
|
|
... merge from different sources</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> So there's some
|
|
issues with regards lack of context/named graphs in rdf
|
|
here.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>whos speaking ?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>chrismessina</cite>> "a financial
|
|
interest in verbs" ?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> yes, the man does
|
|
have financial interest in verbs :)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>rreck:</cite> where to find verbs</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>chrismessina</cite>>
|
|
"unnatural"</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> ah, i heard
|
|
financial too</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> :)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>rreck:</cite> categorisation of verbs,
|
|
broken into categories<br />
|
|
... similar syntactially, etc.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> I mean, you know,
|
|
people do get paid for computational linguistics.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>MacTed</cite>> SIOC helps handle
|
|
this distinction -- between "document description" (i.e., file
|
|
metadata) and "content description" (i.e., named entities used
|
|
in text *within* the file)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>rreck:</cite> wordnet is one of them</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>MacTed</cite>> Container is the key
|
|
element</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>rreck:</cite> will contact offline</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>chrismessina</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://wiki.activitystrea.ms/Process">http://wiki.activitystrea.ms/Process</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> posted a link to
|
|
the activity streams process</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> so just to
|
|
summarize what I was saying above: the content of an atom
|
|
format is something that has to end up being mapped to a Graph.
|
|
So before SPARQL was out and named graphs were well accepted in
|
|
the semweb community, it was a bit diffiuclt to express this in
|
|
RDF.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> important thing:
|
|
about interoperability<br />
|
|
... communication between one and other</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> non-thinking
|
|
entities --- companies or computers?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> want to avoid
|
|
people inventing new verbs again and again<br />
|
|
... wht types of activities are needed from a publisher point
|
|
of view<br />
|
|
... to communicate</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> So, maybe one way
|
|
to say it, the verbs we are interested are "domain-specific" to
|
|
the social web.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> interested in
|
|
getting a core set of verbs to begin with<br />
|
|
... as anytime a new verb is added. lots of people are required
|
|
to use them<br />
|
|
... URIs for new verbs<br />
|
|
... registries of verbs<br />
|
|
... synonyms can be done later on<br />
|
|
... very obvisou verbs of the social web<br />
|
|
... as standards as possible<br />
|
|
... and then grows from there</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Zakim</cite>> danbri, you wanted to
|
|
ask re TV viewing feed examples (xbmc/boxee etc)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> starting with 40
|
|
verbs (approx.)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>chrismessina</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://martin.atkins.me.uk/specs/activitystreams/activityschema">
|
|
http://martin.atkins.me.uk/specs/activitystreams/activityschema</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> the one seen used
|
|
on the web</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://martin.atkins.me.uk/specs/activitystreams/activityschema">
|
|
http://martin.atkins.me.uk/specs/activitystreams/activityschema</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Ack, chrismessina
|
|
beat me :)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>chrismessina</cite>> ;) sorry!</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>petef</cite>> danbri have you seen
|
|
<a href=
|
|
"http://testtubetelly.channel4.com/?">http://testtubetelly.channel4.com/?</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>chrismessina</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://wiki.activitystrea.ms/Verb-Mapping">http://wiki.activitystrea.ms/Verb-Mapping</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> verb-mapping<br />
|
|
... took a lok at the verbs visible on a site<br />
|
|
... evaluated the existing formats<br />
|
|
... then take the verbs and the way they describe the
|
|
activities</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>petef</cite>> Test Tube Telly is a
|
|
good use case for Activity Streams and TV.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> a few classes of
|
|
activities<br />
|
|
... and mapped them with the existing<br />
|
|
... boxee.tv<br />
|
|
... few unknown verbs</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hajons</cite>> boxee.tv</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> work with the
|
|
community to see how you implement it is ok<br />
|
|
... then implements</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>chrismessina</cite>> boxee.tv</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> does anyone else
|
|
think SKOS when they read verb mapping?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> create ver,
|
|
document, implement, get feedback</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Yes, SKOS could be
|
|
useful here,</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>pchampin</cite>> +1 SKOS</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>danbri:</cite> disambiguation ?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> ok, got to go to
|
|
another conf call.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> i would love to show
|
|
a interoperable approach for verb mapping using skos</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> but it would be
|
|
useful to have the vocabulary of activity streams published as
|
|
RDF linked data</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>-1 for skos for verbs (while the SKOS
|
|
properties are useful)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> which of course would
|
|
mean lots of this information is available out of the box</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> and have that
|
|
mapped in such as a way that it can fit in with AtomOWL
|
|
transform...</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> examples of what
|
|
comes out of boxee: <a href=
|
|
"http://twitter.com/bandriball">http://twitter.com/bandriball</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> some can use
|
|
microformats, wikipedia page, etc.<br />
|
|
... author, title and body content<br />
|
|
... then enclosure, but pretty weak<br />
|
|
... adding the actor of the post</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> eg <a href=
|
|
"http://twitter.com/bandriball/status/5148136281">http://twitter.com/bandriball/status/5148136281</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> adding some
|
|
microformats in the content to parse the object and iunderstand
|
|
what it is<br />
|
|
... great problem to address then<br />
|
|
... but need to get the issue first</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Zakim</cite>> pchampin, you wanted
|
|
to ask a very basic question about cliqset</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>pchampin:</cite> cliqset: generate
|
|
activity streams from different sources<br />
|
|
... to what extent do you get the correct verb from these
|
|
sources ?<br />
|
|
... feed reformating or getting information from the site using
|
|
API ?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>chrismessina</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://feedproxy.cliqset.com/">http://feedproxy.cliqset.com/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>pchampin</cite>> it *is* great
|
|
:)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> consume the feed
|
|
from the provider<br />
|
|
... hope that richer amount of information will come from the
|
|
sources<br />
|
|
... more precise verbs that show up in the feed<br />
|
|
... or richer object definition<br />
|
|
... define tthe target of an activity<br />
|
|
... e.g. adding flickr to a set in flickr<br />
|
|
... tracking a photo album, etc.<br />
|
|
... as opposed to follow each individual picture</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>pchampin</cite>> thanks</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> in my experience
|
|
shame doesnt work</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>chrismessina</cite>>
|
|
buddypress.org</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> would like to get
|
|
buddypress adopt activiystreams<br />
|
|
... open source PHP activity streams parser would be
|
|
great<br />
|
|
... convincing people to adopt it</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>chrismessina</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://dev.opera.com/libraries/activitystream/">http://dev.opera.com/libraries/activitystream/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> chrismessina, you're
|
|
saying there's no good opensrc php consumer, yet?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>chrismessina</cite>> there is
|
|
not</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> underlying code /
|
|
libraries should accelerate the adoption</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> ok, maybe i know a
|
|
funded project that might help there ... (www.notube.tv) ... do
|
|
you have a requirements spec?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> labourML?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Sounds british
|
|
:)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>chrismessina</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://userlabor.org/">http://userlabor.org/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Will note
|
|
that...</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> other examples of
|
|
formats for activities</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>chrismessina</cite>> <a href=
|
|
"http://socialdesktop.org/">http://socialdesktop.org/</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> social
|
|
desktop<br />
|
|
... linkedin</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Well, just looking
|
|
for other tech in the same space, but it's clear
|
|
activitystreams seems to have the momentum...</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> none of them is
|
|
moving forward interoperable standards</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> also some discussion
|
|
around xmpp community for activity streams over xmpp ---
|
|
<a href=
|
|
"http://mail.jabber.org/pipermail/social/2009-April/000536.html">
|
|
http://mail.jabber.org/pipermail/social/2009-April/000536.html</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> shoudl be
|
|
interoperable, shoud be open<br />
|
|
... role of W3C: valuable to provide spotlight on this
|
|
work<br />
|
|
... thinking about the role W3C plays in incubating
|
|
things<br />
|
|
... boards member of the OpenWeb fundation<br />
|
|
... as it was hard to understand how W3C coudl bootstrap such
|
|
grassroots projects<br />
|
|
... take about 1.5 years / 2 years<br />
|
|
... but becoming a defacto standard<br />
|
|
... while working independantly from a standard body</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> I think it's a
|
|
great amount of success...</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> like to see other
|
|
similar efforts succeed as well<br />
|
|
... based on the work theyre doing</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> (+1 to all that)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> interested in how
|
|
this kind of work can be supported</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> would like to outline
|
|
some kind of plan<br />
|
|
... should W3C provide infrastructure<br />
|
|
... what are the pros and cons<br />
|
|
... IP policies, etc.<br />
|
|
... transition period, time for suggestions<br />
|
|
... looking for suggestions</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>chrismessina</cite>> linkedin's
|
|
verbs: <a href=
|
|
"http://developer.linkedin.com/docs/DOC-1006">http://developer.linkedin.com/docs/DOC-1006</a></p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>DKA:</cite> how W3C can help such
|
|
efforts</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> brainstorming about
|
|
how to open up W3C and get relationships with all other
|
|
foundations and standards bodies would be useful.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>DKA:</cite> W3C key goal is to let the
|
|
web open</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> and what resources
|
|
the W3C has to offer the wider community</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> (mentioned <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2009/11/TPAC/">http://www.w3.org/2009/11/TPAC/</a>
|
|
)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>DKA:</cite> XG process started few years
|
|
ago</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> it's just kinda
|
|
unclear what the wider community wants.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>DKA:</cite> time for starting working on
|
|
such topics<br />
|
|
... lots of XG now</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> wider = everyone
|
|
working to keep the web open</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>cperey</cite>> +1</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>DKA:</cite> question shoud be how can
|
|
W3C facilitate such efforts</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> DISO and activity
|
|
projects done on spare time<br />
|
|
... did them as believe in Open Web<br />
|
|
... find things to build better and richer solutions<br />
|
|
... compagnies that have IP who decided that they come together
|
|
to advance the set of things<br />
|
|
... avoid to much fragmentation of a market<br />
|
|
... Web is a more fluid place, subject to changes<br />
|
|
... very essential to come up with patterns that are easy to
|
|
adopt / use<br />
|
|
... to drive interoperable standards</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> it's more a w3c
|
|
observation</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> bring new protocols
|
|
but make sure to ensure the openess<br />
|
|
... standards bodies created solutions for large compagnies</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Good point re ramp
|
|
for smaller projects</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Zakim</cite>> danbri, you wanted to
|
|
mention w3c process is in-scope</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> we need some sort
|
|
of relationship re smaller bodies.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> and now the massive
|
|
amount of creativity which is in the grassroots</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> (and then
|
|
relationships with larger bodies like IETF)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> you broke up a little
|
|
danbri</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>cperey</cite>> getting late,
|
|
guys</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>cperey</cite>> we need to (cut the
|
|
song short and) close this meeting!</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> basically W3C can be
|
|
what we make of it, ...</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> we'll close after
|
|
question from tpa</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> openess in an
|
|
networked world</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> but feel free to
|
|
exist..</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> free to exit.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> W3C becomes an
|
|
engie for interoperability of open technologies</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> one of the issues re
|
|
w3c membership model, is that it becomes hard to structure w3c
|
|
so pressure is put on its members to play well w/
|
|
standards...</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> tim?</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> (because they're
|
|
supplying $)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> efforts like openid and
|
|
oauth where supported by people working on the Web<br />
|
|
... much more idealist process<br />
|
|
... W3C has not doing that so far<br />
|
|
... q on activity streams<br />
|
|
... lots of discussion on publishing and having people on
|
|
boards</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>danbri</cite>> (re individuals vs
|
|
employers, ... often people do have relevant employers, but
|
|
it's the individual who is the driver, and the employer
|
|
situation is often damage control, ie. making sure they behave
|
|
well re patents)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> but cannot find lot of
|
|
applications</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> challenging in
|
|
terms of adoption<br />
|
|
... motivate the consumer<br />
|
|
... then producers<br />
|
|
... chicken and egg problem</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> I imagine Chrome
|
|
will take it up...</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'><cite>chrismessina:</cite> windows live
|
|
support<br />
|
|
... if you create a widget, it produces a stream<br />
|
|
... friends are able to subscribe<br />
|
|
... P2P process to the browsers<br />
|
|
... larger publishers (youtube, NYT)<br />
|
|
... more a timing issue<br />
|
|
... once spec will be out, hope to see rapid adoption<br />
|
|
... twitter introduced an important verb: to follow<br />
|
|
... can follow people whatever client is used</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> we dont' have any
|
|
clear answers quite yet</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Chris Messina
|
|
Prime</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> thanks Chris</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>chrismessina</cite>> thanks
|
|
all!</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hajons</cite>> thanks!</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tpa</cite>> thanks :)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>DKA</cite>> +1 thanks Chris!</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='phone'>thanks!</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Adam</cite>> we will be adding it
|
|
to our existing activity streams</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>Adam</cite>> inside Boeing</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Meeting
|
|
Adjourned.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> bye all</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>pchampin</cite>> thx</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>melvster</cite>> thx</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tpa</cite>> AlexPassant:, hhalpin
|
|
there were some typos / misunderstanding in the writeup of my
|
|
last comment</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tpa</cite>> How should I propose
|
|
edits to that :)</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> tpa, just rewrite
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the comment here</p>
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|
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> and i'll fix it
|
|
when I clean up the meeting.</p>
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|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tpa</cite>> tpa: efforts like
|
|
openid and oauth where supported by people working on the Web
|
|
but not necessarily in the right field so they tend to
|
|
participate as individuals. W3C should probably have a clear
|
|
policy of allowing individuals to join to attract the same kind
|
|
of crowd and efforts</p>
|
|
|
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> excellent.</p>
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|
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<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> we should have a
|
|
telecon on W3C process and W3C role once we have some strawman
|
|
proposals.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tpa</cite>> tpa: also, have a more
|
|
iterative process, like those groups, which historically the
|
|
W3C has not been good at.</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tpa</cite>> hhalpin: yes, that'd be
|
|
great</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tpa</cite>> I think there are some
|
|
clear point to report back on</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>tpa</cite>> but we're so in the
|
|
middle of them, we don't necessarily see them</p>
|
|
|
|
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> trackbot, end
|
|
meeting</p>
|
|
</div>
|
|
|
|
<h2><a name="ActionSummary" id="ActionSummary">Summary of Action
|
|
Items</a></h2><!-- Action Items -->
|
|
<strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> (2 weeks) hhalpin
|
|
explain to henry and oshani doc editing process for usecases (2
|
|
weeks) [recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action09">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action09</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> tanglade to tag
|
|
existing stories [recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action11">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action11</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<br />
|
|
<strong>[PENDING]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> (2 weeks)
|
|
hhalpin explain to henry and oshani doc editing process for
|
|
usecases (2 weeks) [recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action10">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action10</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<strong>[PENDING]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> adam to take
|
|
on corporate story [recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action03">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action03</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<strong>[PENDING]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> bblfish to
|
|
merge Family and Group access usecases (2 weeks) [recorded in
|
|
<a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action08">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action08</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<strong>[PENDING]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> bblfish to
|
|
relabel data protection use case to be about controlled access
|
|
and takedown to data "about" you (2 weeks) [recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action07">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action07</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<strong>[PENDING]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> danbri to
|
|
find someone from Opera to talk Widgets (2 weeks) [recorded in
|
|
<a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action12">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action12</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<strong>[PENDING]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> hhalpin to
|
|
try to get TimBL to either talk or write-up his use-cases
|
|
[recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action13">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action13</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<strong>[PENDING]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> oshani to
|
|
reframe the geolocation/intent/portability (2 weeks) [recorded in
|
|
<a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action06">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action06</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<strong>[PENDING]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> rreck to
|
|
flesh out anonymous usecase connecting to multiple identies and
|
|
null provenance (rreck) [recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action05">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action05</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<br />
|
|
<strong>[DONE]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> (2 weeks) adam
|
|
to write up the boeing use case for enterprise social networks
|
|
[recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action04">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action04</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<strong>[DONE]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> cperey to take
|
|
business narrative [recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action01">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action01</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<strong>[DONE]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> cperey to take
|
|
business narrative [recorded in <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action02">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action02</a>]<br />
|
|
|
|
<br />
|
|
[End of minutes]<br />
|
|
<hr />
|
|
|
|
<address>
|
|
Minutes formatted by David Booth's <a href=
|
|
"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm">
|
|
scribe.perl</a> version 1.135 (<a href=
|
|
"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/">CVS log</a>)<br />
|
|
$Date: 2009/12/02 17:33:25 $
|
|
</address>
|
|
|
|
<div class="diagnostics">
|
|
<hr />
|
|
|
|
<h2>Scribe.perl diagnostic output</h2>[Delete this section
|
|
before finalizing the minutes.]<br />
|
|
<pre>
|
|
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.135 of Date: 2009/03/02 03:52:20
|
|
Check for newer version at <a href=
|
|
"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/">http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/</a>
|
|
|
|
Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)
|
|
|
|
Succeeded: s/extend/extent/
|
|
Succeeded: s/temr/term/
|
|
Succeeded: s/tome/some/
|
|
Succeeded: s/boxy (?)/boxee.tv/
|
|
Succeeded: s/port/post/
|
|
Succeeded: s/effots/efforts/
|
|
Succeeded: s/straman/strawman/
|
|
Found Scribe: AlexPassant
|
|
Found ScribeNick: AlexPassant
|
|
Default Present: +39.011.228.aaaa, +049172247aabb, hhalpin, +1.774.811.aacc, +1.781.273.aadd, claudio, MacTed, +7.970.94.aaff, rreck, AlexPassant, tpa
|
|
Present: +39.011.228.aaaa +049172247aabb hhalpin +1.774.811.aacc +1.781.273.aadd claudio MacTed +7.970.94.aaff rreck AlexPassant tpa
|
|
Found Date: 02 Dec 2009
|
|
Guessing minutes URL: <a href=
|
|
"http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html</a>
|
|
|
|
WARNING: No person found for ACTION item: (2 weeks) hhalpin explain to henry and oshani doc editing process for usecases (2 weeks) [recorded in <a href="http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action10">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action10</a>]
|
|
|
|
|
|
WARNING: No person found for ACTION item: (2 weeks) hhalpin explain to henry and oshani doc editing process for usecases (2 weeks) [recorded in <a href="http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action09">http://www.w3.org/2009/12/02-swxg-minutes.html#action09</a>]
|
|
|
|
People with action items: adam bblfish danbri hhalpin oshani rreck tanglade
|
|
|
|
</pre>[End of <a href=
|
|
"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm">
|
|
scribe.perl</a> diagnostic output]
|
|
</div>
|
|
</body>
|
|
</html>
|